VQ and CC

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kioti said:
I'm pretty sure it's legal. If memory serves, my brother and his Sierra Club trail building group put it in as a shortcut to the Coldwater Trail from Lower Holy Jim/Main Divide. They worked on trails all over the Santa Ana's in the days before mountain bikes, and did everything with permits, etc. Since then the Warriors have maintained and partially rerouted it.
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I've seen some maps with the old trail that drops down behind the water tank at Main Divide near Lower HJ (before it was re-routed to present exit up alittle ways on MD). In fact you can still see the trail there behind the water tank, so possible some hikers still use it. Heard from someone that rode UHJ earlier this week, and that it was not that bad, so "thanks" to Mike Caffrey for the clean up, even though it sounds like it wasn't used for CC/VQ this year...

And congrats to all the CC/VQ people today, hot and dry out there today, can't imagine the hurt....
 
HBkites said:
Another CC is in the book.
This one 3e minutes faster than 2014.
I can't explain it other then my overall riding ability has improved (my fitness level is low IMO)
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That's pretty cool, Sharone. Any more thoughts on the ride? Like, how was the Motorway? Was the Main Divide really dusty? Did you have a problem making the cut-off at 4 Corners? Did you wish you had a fat bike for riding through trash piles at the top of Maple Springs? ( j/k) How did the ride over the peak go, how was the descent down Holy Jim; were there any other notable issues? Nutrition, weather..

Same questions to any VQ riders out there, as well as @mtnbikej.. including, how was West Horsethief, the Wall, the Trabuco Trail descent, the Trabuco Wash..? Inquiring minds would love to know! :inlove:
 
kioti said:
That's pretty cool, Sharone. Any more thoughts on the ride? Like, how was the Motorway? Was the Main Divide really dusty? Did you have a problem making the cut-off at 4 Corners? Did you wish you had a fat bike for riding through trash piles at the top of Maple Springs? ( j/k) How did the ride over the peak go, how was the descent down Holy Jim; were there any other notable issues? Nutrition, weather..

Same questions to any VQ riders out there, as well as @mtnbikej.. including, how was West Horsethief, the Wall, the Trabuco Trail descent, the Trabuco Wash..? Inquiring minds would love to know! :inlove:
Click to expand...

Well....I didn't do the WHT/Trabuco loop....we had someone else sweeping that loop.

We avoided the really loose/silty/powderpuff section of Main Divide(Bedford to 4 Corners). Blackstar to Motorway is in great shape. Maple Springs given the high traffic is still in great shape. Some of the turns that have the reverse swells for water are getting little powdery, but still not bad at all. As expected, being as dry as it is, you do get dusted out when a motor vehicle goes by.

4 Corners to Modjeska Peak is actually pretty good right now. Steve and I both cleaned the really crappy shale section. Again, with the amount of jeep traffic, the shale and rocks have kinda interlocked like pavers, so it was pretty solid.

Modjeska to Santiago Peak are excellent....normal rocky and hardpacked.

The first 1/4 mile down from Santiago Peak to the first hard right turn looks like a war zone. The holes and craters are big enough to eat several people(similar to the ones cut into the top of Motorway)...plus it's getting loose and silty. Main Divide through the canopy is great. Once back out into the steepest/exposed section above UHJ....it is rocky, loose and silty...but I have seen it worse.

UHJ down to LHJ the road is a combination of all the conditions above.

LHJ the trail is great....but it is overgrown....very overgrown.

Trabuco Creek Rd was graded some time after the Holy Fire, so it is really smooth all the way out.
 
Yesterday was my 5th VQ and by far my hardest, like the other 4 I did it on my single speed. It seemed like the start line was really empty, I'm curious to see how big the DNS list is.

Last time is set a PR on every segment to the bottom of motorway and paid for that speed at the end of the day. This time I was shooting for a 2:10 at the first aid station and was running just a few minutes behind. I was not to worried because I know you can make that all up on the climb to the peak. Hit 4 corners with a maple time of around an hour fifteen and then the wheels came off. The ride to the peak was really slow and challenging. Bagged the peak and headed down to holy Jim. Holy Jim was in great shape and fun, all the hikers were great to move over. Hit the second aid station in about 5:15 which is about 35 minutes off pace. Made a quick stop refilled and started the ride up to horse thief. This was my breaking point and the hardest part of the ride. The sun just started to bake on me and for the first time in any race I almost gave up. I was hot, tired and doing this 4 times before knew what I had ahead of me. Got some encouragement from some fellow riders and kept moving. Got to the top of wht around 7:10 which is 10 minutes before my fastest total time. I knew a few hours prior that a good time was out so not to worried. Got my hamburger and a small cup of Coke and made the trek to Trabuco. Trabuco was in great shape but I wasn't. Had to stop a few times to rest my hands. Hit the wash and was greeted with a headwind. Head down and pedal to the finish where I had family waiting. 8:20, an hour slower than my best.

I did not put the miles in this year and it showed. I needed to make more time to join @mtnbikej and @Faust29 on their big rides. Summer heat, new job and a busy family schedule kept me off to many long rides. I of course said never again but I said that 4 times before.
 
singlespeedrider said:
Yesterday was my 5th VQ and by far my hardest, like the other 4 I did it on my single speed. It seemed like the start line was really empty, I'm curious to see how big the DNS list is.

Last time is set a PR on every segment to the bottom of motorway and paid for that speed at the end of the day. This time I was shooting for a 2:10 at the first aid station and was running just a few minutes behind. I was not to worried because I know you can make that all up on the climb to the peak. Hit 4 corners with a maple time of around an hour fifteen and then the wheels came off. The ride to the peak was really slow and challenging. Bagged the peak and headed down to holy Jim. Holy Jim was in great shape and fun, all the hikers were great to move over. Hit the second aid station in about 5:15 which is about 35 minutes off pace. Made a quick stop refilled and started the ride up to horse thief. This was my breaking point and the hardest part of the ride. The sun just started to bake on me and for the first time in any race I almost gave up. I was hot, tired and doing this 4 times before knew what I had ahead of me. Got some encouragement from some fellow riders and kept moving. Got to the top of wht around 7:10 which is 10 minutes before my fastest total time. I knew a few hours prior that a good time was out so not to worried. Got my hamburger and a small cup of Coke and made the trek to Trabuco. Trabuco was in great shape but I wasn't. Had to stop a few times to rest my hands. Hit the wash and was greeted with a headwind. Head down and pedal to the finish where I had family waiting. 8:20, an hour slower than my best.

I did not put the miles in this year and it showed. I needed to make more time to join @mtnbikej and @Faust29 on their big rides. Summer heat, new job and a busy family schedule kept me off to many long rides. I of course said never again but I said that 4 times before.
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You didn't look like you were hurting when you crossed the finish line! Great job... I think time is irrelevant. Any finish is awesome. :thumbsup: And, you're talking me into trying it next time... Just so I can say I've done it!
 
singlespeedrider said:
Yesterday was my 5th VQ and by far my hardest, like the other 4 I did it on my single speed. It seemed like the start line was really empty, I'm curious to see how big the DNS list is.

Last time is set a PR on every segment to the bottom of motorway and paid for that speed at the end of the day. This time I was shooting for a 2:10 at the first aid station and was running just a few minutes behind. I was not to worried because I know you can make that all up on the climb to the peak. Hit 4 corners with a maple time of around an hour fifteen and then the wheels came off. The ride to the peak was really slow and challenging. Bagged the peak and headed down to holy Jim. Holy Jim was in great shape and fun, all the hikers were great to move over. Hit the second aid station in about 5:15 which is about 35 minutes off pace. Made a quick stop refilled and started the ride up to horse thief. This was my breaking point and the hardest part of the ride. The sun just started to bake on me and for the first time in any race I almost gave up. I was hot, tired and doing this 4 times before knew what I had ahead of me. Got some encouragement from some fellow riders and kept moving. Got to the top of wht around 7:10 which is 10 minutes before my fastest total time. I knew a few hours prior that a good time was out so not to worried. Got my hamburger and a small cup of Coke and made the trek to Trabuco. Trabuco was in great shape but I wasn't. Had to stop a few times to rest my hands. Hit the wash and was greeted with a headwind. Head down and pedal to the finish where I had family waiting. 8:20, an hour slower than my best.

I did not put the miles in this year and it showed. I needed to make more time to join @mtnbikej and @Faust29 on their big rides. Summer heat, new job and a busy family schedule kept me off to many long rides. I of course said never again but I said that 4 times before.
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An hour off your fastest time but light years ahead of all of us who've never done it. 8:20 still seems fast to me for that ride, especially in hot conditions. Sorry you weren't feeling better, but in some regards overcoming the challenge of under-training and feeling beat makes it an even more impressive accomplishment. Kudos for hanging in there, and thanks for your report, Mark!
 
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Faust29 said:
You didn't look like you were hurting when you crossed the finish line! Great job... I think time is irrelevant. Any finish is awesome. :thumbsup: And, you're talking me into trying it next time... Just so I can say I've done it!
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Everybody should experience 2 or 3 times. :thumbsup:

ON a side note....Amy says now that she has finished it....she is never doing it again. I told her, I will see her out there in April. :laugh:
 
kioti said:
An hour off your fastest time but light years ahead of all of us who've never done it. 8:20 still seems fast to me for that ride, especially in hot conditions. Sorry you weren't feeling better, but in some regards overcoming the challenge of under training and feeling beat makes it an even more impressive accomplishment. Kudos for hanging in there, and thanks for your report, Mark!
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Fortunately....or unfortunately, however you wanna look at it. Temps yesterday were nice and cool for most of the morning....but as normal, the sun comes out just as you start the climb up Trabuco, then just bakes you on the slog up WHT. I'd bet it could be raining everywhere else in the SA's, until you reach the bottom of WHT and the skies would clear, and it would just be hot and sunny.
 
mtnbikej said:
Well....I didn't do the WHT/Trabuco loop....we had someone else sweeping that loop.

We avoided the really loose/silty/powderpuff section of Main Divide(Bedford to 4 Corners). Blackstar to Motorway is in great shape. Maple Springs given the high traffic is still in great shape. Some of the turns that have the reverse swells for water are getting little powdery, but still not bad at all. As expected, being as dry as it is, you do get dusted out when a motor vehicle goes by.

4 Corners to Modjeska Peak is actually pretty good right now. Steve and I both cleaned the really crappy shale section. Again, with the amount of jeep traffic, the shale and rocks have kinda interlocked like pavers, so it was pretty solid.

Modjeska to Santiago Peak are excellent....normal rocky and hardpacked.

The first 1/4 mile down from Santiago Peak to the first hard right turn looks like a war zone. The holes and craters are big enough to eat several people(similar to the ones cut into the top of Motorway)...plus it's getting loose and silty. Main Divide through the canopy is great. Once back out into the steepest/exposed section above UHJ....it is rocky, loose and silty...but I have seen it worse.

UHJ down to LHJ the road is a combination of all the conditions above.

LHJ the trail is great....but it is overgrown....very overgrown.

Trabuco Creek Rd was graded some time after the Holy Fire, so it is really smooth all the way out.
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Thanks for breaking it down, Jason, as well as volunteering and riding sweep. Based on your course description, it sounds like a good time for some of us lookie-loos to "seek the peak." :thumbsup:

Good job on the Warrior's part for weathering the fire closure and getting this event going again. Hopefully it continues to build back into the successful ride it's been in the past.
 
kioti said:
Thanks for breaking it down, Jason, as well as volunteering and riding sweep. Based on your course description, it sounds like a good time for some of us lookie-loos to "seek the peak." :thumbsup:

Good job on the Warrior's part for weathering the fire closure and getting this event going again. Hopefully it continues to build back into the successful ride it's been in the past.
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Thanks....I think once we get it back on track in it's normal time slot, it will be better.

I enjoy riding sweep....gives me a chance to interact with those who are truely preservering at the back of the pack.

We tried to talk the DFL rider up Maple Springs to press on. Actually, we did talk him into it....but it only lasted about 50' before he gave in and called it.

Talked to the rider that slipped behind us on the way to Modjeska Peak at the finish....he said that this was his 4th or 5th Coup Feather...but this one meant the most to him.
 
singlespeedrider said:
Yesterday was my 5th VQ and by far my hardest, like the other 4 I did it on my single speed. It seemed like the start line was really empty, I'm curious to see how big the DNS list is.

Last time is set a PR on every segment to the bottom of motorway and paid for that speed at the end of the day. This time I was shooting for a 2:10 at the first aid station and was running just a few minutes behind. I was not to worried because I know you can make that all up on the climb to the peak. Hit 4 corners with a maple time of around an hour fifteen and then the wheels came off. The ride to the peak was really slow and challenging. Bagged the peak and headed down to holy Jim. Holy Jim was in great shape and fun, all the hikers were great to move over. Hit the second aid station in about 5:15 which is about 35 minutes off pace. Made a quick stop refilled and started the ride up to horse thief. This was my breaking point and the hardest part of the ride. The sun just started to bake on me and for the first time in any race I almost gave up. I was hot, tired and doing this 4 times before knew what I had ahead of me. Got some encouragement from some fellow riders and kept moving. Got to the top of wht around 7:10 which is 10 minutes before my fastest total time. I knew a few hours prior that a good time was out so not to worried. Got my hamburger and a small cup of Coke and made the trek to Trabuco. Trabuco was in great shape but I wasn't. Had to stop a few times to rest my hands. Hit the wash and was greeted with a headwind. Head down and pedal to the finish where I had family waiting. 8:20, an hour slower than my best.

I did not put the miles in this year and it showed. I needed to make more time to join @mtnbikej and @Faust29 on their big rides. Summer heat, new job and a busy family schedule kept me off to many long rides. I of course said never again but I said that 4 times before.
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We had less spots sold. We closed registration a few days before the event with spots still available.

We were talking about it at Aid Station 1. We came to the conclusion in a normal VQ cycle...that the fast guys are always fast. The riders in the middle are the ones who put the time in make a decent time, but will still struggle from time to time. The riders at the back of the pack are the ones that are usually at the cusp of being over their heads, and struggle to make the time cutoffs. This year we figured with the odd schedule/non normal training schedule....the fast guys were fine, the mid packers were a little slower, and the back of the packers just didn't even bother to show up.

We had a lot less females out there this time.

We kept waiting for the madness that usually engulfs Aid Station 1....this year you could almost hear the crickets.

On a side note, Tinker came through the bottom of Motorway at 1:35.
 
sometimes it takes me an hour and a half just to get to Beeks........ Amazing

Edit: Seriously- an hour and a half to bottom of Motorway???!!!! That's just...... I don't even have words for that
 
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Easier to drive, much less fun to ride!
"Trabuco Creek Road"


mtnbikej said:
Well....I didn't do the WHT/Trabuco loop....we had someone else sweeping that loop.

We avoided the really loose/silty/powderpuff section of Main Divide(Bedford to 4 Corners). Blackstar to Motorway is in great shape. Maple Springs given the high traffic is still in great shape. Some of the turns that have the reverse swells for water are getting little powdery, but still not bad at all. As expected, being as dry as it is, you do get dusted out when a motor vehicle goes by.

4 Corners to Modjeska Peak is actually pretty good right now. Steve and I both cleaned the really crappy shale section. Again, with the amount of jeep traffic, the shale and rocks have kinda interlocked like pavers, so it was pretty solid.

Modjeska to Santiago Peak are excellent....normal rocky and hardpacked.

The first 1/4 mile down from Santiago Peak to the first hard right turn looks like a war zone. The holes and craters are big enough to eat several people(similar to the ones cut into the top of Motorway)...plus it's getting loose and silty. Main Divide through the canopy is great. Once back out into the steepest/exposed section above UHJ....it is rocky, loose and silty...but I have seen it worse.

UHJ down to LHJ the road is a combination of all the conditions above.

LHJ the trail is great....but it is overgrown....very overgrown.

Trabuco Creek Rd was graded some time after the Holy Fire, so it is really smooth all the way out.
Click to expand...
 
Was my 5th CC to go along with 5 VQs. I knew I wasn't in the best of shape, so I rode my geared bike, really paced myself, and had a good time out there. Finished about ~20 minutes off my PR, which is about as good as I expected. Glad I didn't ride the singlespeed, that would've hurt!

I thought the course was really in great shape. The usually loose climbs on the Main Divide were better than usual, and so was that rocky climb past 4 corners before the first set of towers.

Thanks to the Warrior's Society for another great Pow Wow, and to all the volunteers. It really is a unique event.
 
mtnbikej said:
On a side note, Tinker came through the bottom of Motorway at 1:35.
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Yeah, Tinker and the lead group of about 20-30 riders stayed together through the pace line until the first part of B* and then slowly pulled away. You could see his light and one other about five minutes in front of the rest of the fast guys near the top of B*.

Oh, and he was riding a full-suspension bike this year instead of his hardtail, so he thought he was a little slower.

And numbers were definitely down. Fitness overall for most was definitely down, even for the fastest people coming to the end of a long season.

I know I was slower, but you can Strava stalk me...its pretty easy to find me.

Most are going to look forward to this taking its regular place in the calendar in early spring.

Great work weathering the closures and the whining that accompanied all the delays.
 
Tinker and I have the same countertops. :D


tinker.jpg
 

Here are some mental notes I have from the event:


Pre race - I woke up too early (3:40 am).

One banana, and one bottle of Scratch Mango (high sodium)

Parked @ the gate @ 4:40, pick up my packet (saw J, but forgot to say hellow), and set around for 30 minutes. Warm up is pointless for this event (that's what the first 2 miles are for IMO).

Decided to forgo any extra layers, but I did ride with elbow G-form sleeves to protect my booboo.

Found a few familiar faces to chat with, but I hate waiting around.


Pace - I didn't pre-ride the course this year (except for black*), so I used 2014 planned timing split for the first half.

1:00:00 gate to gate (actual 1:01)

2:10:00 top of Motorway (2:09)

2:30:00 Maple spring (2:29)

Once I got to MS, I just used my HRM to control the pace the rest of the way.


Equipment- I used my Trek HT as planned. Craig Hopps replace the Chainring, chain and front tire on it while I was in Sedona.

I had to replace my frozen front brake (Guide RS) two days before the event (I used the one for my SS). I should have done all these changes a few weeks before, but I'm a procrastinator.

I definitely wouldn't recommend using a new (and unfamiliar) front tire, but the 2.2 Icon work well.

The last two hours I had some major numbing in both handles. I need to look at different grips for long rides.


The course - Gate to Motorway was in good shape.

I don't like Motorway. Never did, and probably never will,

MS is uneventfully. I wasn't pushing the pace, Just trying to keep the cadence up and my butt glued to the seat.

4 Corners to Majeska was in good shape most of the way to many f@cking cars. I ended up stuck behind one on the downhill section from Majeska to Santiago (dust cake in my mouth).

the climb and descent to (and from) Santiago was tough but manageable. That was the only I wished I had FS bike.

Holy Jim was nice, but overgrown. I missed judged one of the switchback, and did a slow OTB. When I got up my saddle was off by 20deg.

I tried riding like that, but I couldn't. While I was looking for my tool I manage to dropped my keys (I need a new key storage strategy).

When I got to the bottom of HJ I realized that I way ahead of the 2014 pace, and decided to gun it.

Finished time was 5:46.

Now all I have left is to ponder how much faster could I have gone without all the distraction I had to deal with this year.


Nutrition -

Pre ride - Banana and Scratch Mango.

During - 3.5 bottle of tailwind (5.5 scoops total) small piece of green banana @ MS, and ½ of PBJ sandwich. Around 8 am I got hungry. The sandwich worked beautifully (along with some fresh water). From the last 2 miles of MS (9am)I felt the pre cramps symptoms in my my legs, but I never cramped. I probably should have consumed more tailwind, but I felt like I was drinking all the time.


The water stop @ 4 corners came in handy I’m not sure why it is “unofficial”. I should have used only 2 water bottles.

The food @ the end was not great (I don’t eat chicken on a bone), but I needed the calories. Chips, Beans, and Salsa mix for lunch was how I rolled.



What’s next…...I came up with 4 options:

  1. Do it again, and try to drop my time to under 5:30.
  2. Try doing CC on SS (pita).
  3. Sign up for VQ, and get that event off my bucket list.
  4. Skip it, and find new challenges.
I got a few weeks to figure it out.

 
HBkites said:
Here are some mental notes I have from the event:


Pre race - I woke up too early (3:40 am).

One banana, and one bottle of Scratch Mango (high sodium)

Parked @ the gate @ 4:40, pick up my packet (saw J, but forgot to say hellow), and set around for 30 minutes. Warm up is pointless for this event (that's what the first 2 miles are for IMO).

Decided to forgo any extra layers, but I did ride with elbow G-form sleeves to protect my booboo.

Found a few familiar faces to chat with, but I hate waiting around.


Pace - I didn't pre-ride the course this year (except for black*), so I used 2014 planned timing split for the first half.

1:00:00 gate to gate (actual 1:01)

2:10:00 top of Motorway (2:09)

2:30:00 Maple spring (2:29)

Once I got to MS, I just used my HRM to control the pace the rest of the way.


Equipment- I used my Trek HT as planned. Craig Hopps replace the Chainring, chain and front tire on it while I was in Sedona.

I had to replace my frozen front brake (Guide RS) two days before the event (I used the one for my SS). I should have done all these changes a few weeks before, but I'm a procrastinator.

I definitely wouldn't recommend using a new (and unfamiliar) front tire, but the 2.2 Icon work well.

The last two hours I had some major numbing in both handles. I need to look at different grips for long rides.


The course - Gate to Motorway was in good shape.

I don't like Motorway. Never did, and probably never will,

MS is uneventfully. I wasn't pushing the pace, Just trying to keep the cadence up and my butt glued to the seat.

4 Corners to Majeska was in good shape most of the way to many f@cking cars. I ended up stuck behind one on the downhill section from Majeska to Santiago (dust cake in my mouth).

the climb and descent to (and from) Santiago was tough but manageable. That was the only I wished I had FS bike.

Holy Jim was nice, but overgrown. I missed judged one of the switchback, and did a slow OTB. When I got up my saddle was off by 20deg.

I tried riding like that, but I couldn't. While I was looking for my tool I manage to dropped my keys (I need a new key storage strategy).

When I got to the bottom of HJ I realized that I way ahead of the 2014 pace, and decided to gun it.

Finished time was 5:46.

Now all I have left is to ponder how much faster could I have gone without all the distraction I had to deal with this year.


Nutrition -

Pre ride - Banana and Scratch Mango.

During - 3.5 bottle of tailwind (5.5 scoops total) small piece of green banana @ MS, and ½ of PBJ sandwich. Around 8 am I got hungry. The sandwich worked beautifully (along with some fresh water). From the last 2 miles of MS (9am)I felt the pre cramps symptoms in my my legs, but I never cramped. I probably should have consumed more tailwind, but I felt like I was drinking all the time.


The water stop @ 4 corners came in handy I’m not sure why it is “unofficial”. I should have used only 2 water bottles.

The food @ the end was not great (I don’t eat chicken on a bone), but I needed the calories. Chips, Beans, and Salsa mix for lunch was how I rolled.



What’s next…...I came up with 4 options:

  1. Do it again, and try to drop my time to under 5:30.
  2. Try doing CC on SS (pita).
  3. Sign up for VQ, and get that event off my bucket list.
  4. Skip it, and find new challenges.
I got a few weeks to figure it out.
Click to expand...

Option 5. VQ on the SS....if you are gonna go big, then go as big as you can.
 
mtnbikej said:
Option 5. VQ on the SS....if you are gonna go big, then go as big as you can.
Click to expand...
LOL. I went through the full progression: CC, then VQ, then CC on the SS, then VQ on the SS. I've done all the options, so now I need to decide what to do in the Spring. I'll tell you, on Saturday it was kinda nice having gears, and even nicer making that right turn down at the bottom of Holy Jim :)
 
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