VQ and CC?

I don't have any insight as to the closure but I do have an opinion or two-hoping the Warrior Society members follow this forum.

There are a few of us riders that have signed up for this event as a "one and done" ride. I'm turning 50, and this is my swan song from MTB events (not that I have done many recently-just not my thing anymore). It's not that I don't love a challenge and love riding, it's just that the timing of this event in April in not ideal for individuals who work long hours, and can only manage one ride a weekend during the daylight savings time of the year. Wouldn't it be better to schedule this event in October when everyone has had a full summer of riding and can take advantage of longer days and weeknight rides to train? It never made much sense to me to have this ride in April. I am a fairly strong rider, but I am no fool. This duration and elevation requires some training; at the least some extended saddle time to get the ol' sit bones acclimated. Anyway, I would like to see the WS push this year's event off to late September or October since the closure of portions of the trail are altering the traditional route. Either that, or let the individuals who chose to, transfer this year's admin fee to next year when the course will be back to the true VQ course. I'm not pained by losing the entry fee, as this is a good cause and I am glad to donate money to the Warriors Society and the event. Just my 2 cents. Ride on and good luck to all!
 
RCT said:
I don't have any insight as to the closure but I do have an opinion or two-hoping the Worrior Society members follow this forum.

There are a few of us riders that have signed up for this event as a "one and done" ride. I'm turning 50, and this is my swan song from MTB events (not that I have done many recently-just not my thing anymore). It's not that I don't love a challenge and love riding, it's just that the timing of this event in April in not ideal for individuals who work long hours, and can only manage one ride a weekend during the daylight savings time of the year. Wouldn't it be better to schedule this event in October when everyone has had a full summer of riding and can take advantage of longer days and weeknight rides to train? It never made much sense to me to have this ride in April. I am a fairly strong rider, but I am no fool. This duration and elevation requires some training; at the least some extended saddle time to get the ol' sit bones acclimated. Anyway, I would like to see the WS push this year's event off to late September or October since the closure of portions of the trail are altering the traditional route. Either that, or let the individuals who chose to, transfer this year's admin fee to next year when the course will be back to the true VQ course. I'm not pained by losing the entry fee, as this is a good cause and I am glad to donate money to the Warriors Society and the event. Just my 2 cents. Ride on and good luck to all!
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We do not do events that late into the year. We have discussed it in the past and even attempte to hold the Toad Festival in Oct. Problem is we begin running into fire season and they are much likelier to issue closures on Red Flag days.

We already moved the event back a month from when we used to hold it. It used to be at the beginning of March, but the weather(rain) again was always a factor....so we moved it to April. We learned that holding the events out there in May/June/July/August is just too hot.....ask anyone who did The Traverse when we held it in June when it was pushing 110*+ at the top of West Horsetheif.

We have done this for 11 years now, so we gone through all the second guessing from people.

350 people sign up, and seem to find the time to train. Everyone is different and everyone trains differently.

We didn't ask for the fire to burn through the Motorway or for the closures....so we are having to adapt.
 
This is very true. I road (and hiked) the main divide between motorway and 4 corners last year just to "check it out." It sucked and I swore I'd never do it again; of course that was before I knew it would be part of the VQ course change. People who think it will be easier than going down motorway and up maple springs are gonna be in for a big surprise.

It may be faster, even with the hike a bike, but in my opinion it's way more difficult to ride.

mtnbikej said:
singlespeedrider said:
HBkites said:
If they eliminate 4miles off the CC (and some elevation) I'll be disappointed as well.... This might be the best year to try and finish a VQ.
I never road from motorway to 4 corners, but I can see some dramatic time saving (maple spring up to 4 corners aprox. 75min for me).

A CC with only one big climb (4 corners to the pick is not a cake walk) and one decent will not be the same...


Hopefully the Rwanda 50 will stay 50 miles (and might prove to be a bigger challenge then the CC this year).
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IMO the ride down Motorway and up Maple Springs is easier than the stretch across Main Divide. Those climbs going up to 4 corners are no joke and very difficult, without some rain they will be a bike hike a bike for most riders.
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Even when they are in good shape, they will still be a HAB for most riders. That being said, I see a record number of finishers based on the time cutoff of 11:30 @ 4 Corners.
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Last weekend I road my first "training" ride for the 2015 CC.
the path bake shop - LHJ - main divide - Trabuco - the Path........

The climb up LHJ kicked my ass.
I' got lots of work to do, but plenty of time to do it.
My plan is to loose 15 lbs by the of March........ My first challenge is to lay off the KitKats tonight. ;)
 
VQ and CC - Date Change

So the Forest Service changed their minds... WS can't use Main Divide, either, so no VQ and CC in April. Excerpt from the e-mail:

As some of you know the Forest Service has closed the part of the forest we use for the first part of the Vision Quest and Counting Coup events. The Forest Recreation Officer informed us originally that we could still use the first part of the course but we would have to continue along the Main Divide because they would not allow us to access the Silverado trail (Motorway) and Maple Springs. We have now been informed that they will not allow any access to the part of the Forest affected by the closure until the forest re-opens after September 30th.

We thought of modifying the event to eliminate the first part of the course but could not find any practical route that would work and we really wanted to stick with the original course. It is because of this that we decided to move the date of the event to Saturday, October 24th. This would be four weeks after the closure ends allowing riders time to pre-run this section of the course.

Don't know if they'll open up any slots due to cancellations (they are offering refunds if you cancel by Feb. 1, and it looks like I'll have to), but it might be worth asking if you didn't get in. Really bummed about this.
 
It was the most practical solution.

We didn't want to completely cancel the event for 2015.

Most people really didn't want to ride a modified course.....it is the VQ/CC....and skipping the first 20 miles would not be the VQ/CC.

Doing the event in October, puts us about the same time around DST as it would in April...so the days are just about the same length.

Most riders will be happy about the extra training time. A full summer of long days and nice weather to go out and train in. Biggest complaint I hear from people about having the event in March/April is how hard it is to train in the winter....so now they have no excuse.
 
Whew! Not I can relax and quit training ... oh wait, I didn't register and I'm not training - :mrgreen:
 
mtnbikej said:
It was the most practical solution.

We didn't want to completely cancel the event for 2015.

Most people really didn't want to ride a modified course.....it is the VQ/CC....and skipping the first 20 miles would not be the VQ/CC.

Doing the event in October, puts us about the same time around DST as it would in April...so the days are just about the same length.

Most riders will be happy about the extra training time. A full summer of long days and nice weather to go out and train in. Biggest complaint I hear from people about having the event in March/April is how hard it is to train in the winter....so now they have no excuse.
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Don't get me wrong... my disappointment is strictly personal (and I was disappointed that it was going to be the alternate route, so I was initially excited for the date change and return to the original course, until I checked the date!) Some additional training time wouldn't hurt me one bit, either! Now I have an extra year.

Any chance the WS might consider letting those who can't race on the October date have a deferment to the 2016 event instead of a refund?
 
BigTex said:
mtnbikej said:
It was the most practical solution.

We didn't want to completely cancel the event for 2015.

Most people really didn't want to ride a modified course.....it is the VQ/CC....and skipping the first 20 miles would not be the VQ/CC.

Doing the event in October, puts us about the same time around DST as it would in April...so the days are just about the same length.

Most riders will be happy about the extra training time. A full summer of long days and nice weather to go out and train in. Biggest complaint I hear from people about having the event in March/April is how hard it is to train in the winter....so now they have no excuse.
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Don't get me wrong... my disappointment is strictly personal (and I was disappointed that it was going to be the alternate route, so I was initially excited for the date change and return to the original course, until I checked the date!) Some additional training time wouldn't hurt me one bit, either! Now I have an extra year.

Any chance the WS might consider letting those who can't race on the October date have a deferment to the 2016 event instead of a refund?
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I didn't see the email that went out to all the participants. From what I gather, you have 2 options....refund or October event. We then go back to normal schedule for 2016(April)
 
Any news on Maple Springs or Motorway? We're getting close to the event and both remain closed. Anyone have any idea if the race is in jeopardy of not happening?
 
Ok.....We are still on.

Reports are that the waterbeds that the BAER(Burn Area Emergency Response) Team installed need to be lowered a bit, otherwise Motorway is as the Motorway always is.
 
I have a fear that as soon as its opened up, there may be some well-intentioned folks on Motorway that would be better served helping out those who have years invested in the trail, going back before the deluges of 2010-2011...any thoughts on publicizing an "official" trail work weekend?

At least that way, if there was work to be done on the trail once opened, it could be done properly.
 
I'm scared of VQ. I'm behind on my training goals (thanks work!), and while I'm sure I can finish it... I'm really starting to get worried about the time cut offs >.<
 
Cougar said:
I'm scared of VQ. I'm behind on my training goals (thanks work!), and while I'm sure I can finish it... I'm really starting to get worried about the time cut offs >.<
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The only cut off you need to worry about is the last one (IMO).....If you don't make it, just head to the finish line, and you got your self a CC (I know it is not the same).
 
HBkites said:
The only cut off you need to worry about is the last one (IMO).....If you don't make it, just head to the finish line, and you got your self a CC (I know it is not the same).
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I've heard that from more than one person, but I'm still nervous. I'm a slow climber, and I'm just nervous. I intend to pre-ride CC in early Oct after things open up. So I'll have an idea of where I actually stand.
 
Not that I'm an expert (and I didn't sleep @ a holiday inn express last night)......, but I do have plenty of unsubstantiated opinions.
Slow climbing is a relative term.
You need to be able to do Gate to Doppler Ball under 75min, and Maple spring to 4 Corners in under 90 min.
If you can't keep that pace you might be too slow of a climber for VQ.


My planed pace last year:
Doppler ball 1:05
Bottom of Motorway 2:30
4 Corners: 4 hrs
Bottom of Holy Jim:6 hrs

(My Garmin malfunctioned @ 4 Corners last year. I don't have good data form the event)
 
HBkites said:
Not that I'm an expert (and I didn't sleep @ a holiday inn express last night)......, but I do have plenty of unsubstantiated opinions.
Slow climbing is a relative term.
You need to be able to do Gate to Doppler Ball under 75min, and Maple spring to 4 Corners in under 90 min.
If you can't keep that pace you might be too slow of a climber for VQ.
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As luck would have it, I did Blackstar to the ball last weekend. I did that climb in 1:32. That's a far cry from 75 minutes. I've never attempted Maple Spring to 4 corners. I'm an endurance AM rider, I'll get there - eventually :) I did a ~7 hour Rwanda for example (6hr moving, 7:14 elapsed).

Thanks for the info, my nervousness seems to be justified :) I'll make some time up on the motorway downhill (yay full suspension), but probably not significant amounts.
 
Cougar said:
As luck would have it, I did Blackstar to the ball last weekend. I did that climb in 1:32. That's a far cry from 75 minutes. I've never attempted Maple Spring to 4 corners. I'm an endurance AM rider, I'll get there - eventually :) I did a ~7 hour Rwanda for example (6hr moving, 7:14 elapsed).

Thanks for the info, my nervousness seems to be justified :) I'll make some time up on the motorway downhill (yay full suspension), but probably not significant amounts.
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Problem is with too much traffic, you can't really get a good run at it....especially if you get stuck in the conga line behind a really slow rider who refuses to move over.
 
mtnbikej said:
Problem is with too much traffic, you can't really get a good run at it....especially if you get stuck in the conga line behind a really slow rider who refuses to move over.
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Nod. It's also why I doubt I'll make a ton of time down either of the Holy Jim's (especially lower) as we'll be fighting up hill traffic.

All of this is justifying my fear of those time cut offs :) This is a big event for me, and I might not be able to swing the cut offs. Then again, DNF > DNS.
 
Cougar said:
Nod. It's also why I doubt I'll make a ton of time down either of the Holy Jim's (especially lower) as we'll be fighting up hill traffic.

All of this is justifying my fear of those time cut offs :) This is a big event for me, and I might not be able to swing the cut offs. Then again, DNF > DNS.
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+1,000,000,000,000.......
 
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