Unoffically Official 2017 VQ and CC Thread

[jasonmason]

I came to the realization that I will never be fully satisfied with my training......

I don't think most of us are ever fully satisfied with our training, especially for an event like this. The hard part with VQ/CC is that by being in the spring, winter weather can throw a curveball and really screw up how you'd hoped to train. Just have to be as adaptable as possible and roll with the punches - and not lose your motivation.

Keep at it! You can still do a lot of catching up over the next few weeks.

 

[jasonmason]

Blackstar is beat up but rideable.

Main Dividend is in good shape.

Motorway is good for 95% of the trail.

Go for it.

Thanks! I saw in the SA Mountains/CNF thread that Blackstar got pretty beat up, so i definitely want to pre-ride it. Didn't see any info in there about Motorway, good to know it's in pretty good shape.

 

[Rumpled]

I've got a spectating question.
I'm planning on watching the start and then driving up to the top of Motorway. Then driving over to 4 Corners. After everyone goes by, head down Maple towards the finish - or maybe poke around Main Divide a bit.
I'd be trying to cheer for some midpack riders. I'm not sure I could get from Blackstar to the top of Motorway before the leaders.
My plan should keep me off the course when racers are present.

 

[mtnbikej]

I've got a spectating question.
I'm planning on watching the start and then driving up to the top of Motorway. Then driving over to 4 Corners. After everyone goes by, head down Maple towards the finish - or maybe poke around Main Divide a bit.
I'd be trying to cheer for some midpack riders. I'm not sure I could get from Blackstar to the top of Motorway before the leaders.
My plan should keep me off the course when racers are present.

It's going to depend on whether the gate is open or not. Still closed.

You will make it far enough that you are off the course, but yeah, I'd bet the leaders will be heading down MW before you get there. Then you are stuck for a while. Remember, the 11:30 cutoff at 4 Corners....so there could still be riders heading up MS until that time.

 

[Rumpled]

Yeah, forgot to mention gates and road conditions.
I do remember that cutoff well.

 

[DBMX119]

I am facing some logistical challenges this year and may be 100% solo. No biggie really, but getting back to my truck could prove challenging. Is there a shuttle from the finish to back to the start? I thought there was in years past, but can't remember.

 

[mtnbikej]

I am facing some logistical challenges this year and may be 100% solo. No biggie really, but getting back to my truck could prove challenging. Is there a shuttle from the finish to back to the start? I thought there was in years past, but can't remember.

Yes, there is usually a shuttle.

 

[Faust29]

E-Mail update... I didn't realize there was going to be a closure for work in the canyons.



Vision Quest Event Update
As some of you have seen posted on various message boards, there will be two 3-day closures affecting the forest fro m March 20th to April 30th. This is so the Marine Corps can use explosives to remove trout dams placed in the stream beds. They want to return the streams to their natural state.

One 3-day closure will affect Silverado Canyon and all the trails/roads in the area (Motorway, Maple Springs) and one will affect the Trabuco Canyon area and the trails leading into the canyon (Holy Jim, Trabuco and West Horse Thief). The Forest will be closed a total of 6 days during this time.

We have been told by the Forest Service that these closures should not affect the event but they will let us know if any overlapping issue comes up.

As far as the trails are concerned the course is in good shape. We plan on going up on the Trabuco Trail on March 25th to brush and remove some slides.

We are moving to an RFID scoring system and hope to expand this to all check points in the future to track participants.

We will have an email with packet pickup and other information two weeks before the event.

Thanks for your support!

 

[Rumpled]

Wouldn't those trout dams be historical structures and require some kind of notice, meetings, EIR, CEQA and such.
Are they getting permits for streambed alteration?

 

[jasonmason]

Hey @Faust29 - remember how we were talking about broken El Mariachis a couple months ago? Guess who just broke their's last weekend at Annadel?

3 1/2 weeks to get a new SS built, sweet. Trying to figure out whether to get this one repaired, or replace it. There's nothing in the Salsa quiver that really strikes me as a replacement.

My short list right now is the Soma Juice, a used El Mar, or...? I'm kinda picky as I want steel, adjustable dropouts, a threaded BB, and a not-too-slack HA. Any other suggestions that might be readily available?

 

[Runs with Scissors]

Kona Big Unit, I think.

 

[mtnbikej]

Hey @Faust29 - remember how we were talking about broken El Mariachis a couple months ago? Guess who just broke their's last weekend at Annadel?

3 1/2 weeks to get a new SS built, sweet. Trying to figure out whether to get this one repaired, or replace it. There's nothing in the Salsa quiver that really strikes me as a replacement.

My short list right now is the Soma Juice, a used El Mar, or...? I'm kinda picky as I want steel, adjustable dropouts, a threaded BB, and a not-too-slack HA. Any other suggestions that might be readily available?

http://www.vassagocycles.com/jabberwocky/

 

[Faust29]

Hey @Faust29 - remember how we were talking about broken El Mariachis a couple months ago? Guess who just broke their's last weekend at Annadel?

3 1/2 weeks to get a new SS built, sweet. Trying to figure out whether to get this one repaired, or replace it. There's nothing in the Salsa quiver that really strikes me as a replacement.

My short list right now is the Soma Juice, a used El Mar, or...? I'm kinda picky as I want steel, adjustable dropouts, a threaded BB, and a not-too-slack HA. Any other suggestions that might be readily available?

Oh no... I know the pain. And I agree about Salsa having nothing in their lineup right now. If the Timberjack had been out when I broke mine, I might have gone that route, but it's no steel el Mariachi... And at the time Salsa tried to steer me towards a credit on a Cutthroat. Yuck. In the end, they paid me $500 to buy another company's frame.

I narrowed it down to the Sir 9 and the Highball... And eventually went with the aluminum Highball. It's not as comfortable and forgiving as the steel frame, but overall, I'm much happier.

Edit: The Vassago was on the list also, but I really don't know anything about their frames...

 

[konakc]

Ok, all you expert VisionQuest/CC guys.. I'm just not getting enough time to ride the big miles for CC. I been up to Santiago Peak, did the Blackstar Motorway, etc. but on different rides. Most big rides are 3-5000. yet to go over 6 thousand in one ride. Thinking I'm in over my head. I'm just gonna do it and if DNF, then so be it. Any advice? I just can't do more than one big ride a week at most.... supplement w/ doing shorter rides once or twice during the week...
Running out of time!!!

 

[konakc]

I would really hate to have a DNF....

 

[Faust29]

Ok, all you expert VisionQuest/CC guys.. I'm just not getting enough time to ride the big miles for CC. I been up to Santiago Peak, did the Blackstar Motorway, etc. but on different rides. Most big rides are 3-5000. yet to go over 6 thousand in one ride. Thinking I'm in over my head. I'm just gonna do it and if DNF, then so be it. Any advice? I just can't do more than one big ride a week at most.... supplement w/ doing shorter rides once or twice during the week...
Running out of time!!!

This will be my first time doing the event... But when we did the Counting Coup course a few weeks ago, my Garmin was on 9,000 feet when we got to the Holy Jim parking lot.

My advice would be to go out, don't look at the Garmin, and just think about getting to the next segment... Staying within your abilities and pace. I break things down mentally, and think of it as a lot of little rides, and not one big one. Black Star gate to gate, Doppler to Hagador, Pleasants to Motorway, Maple Pavement, Maple dirt, Chunky stuff to Modjeska, Saddle cruise, Push to the peak, Main Divide DH, etc... All of those are easy by themselves.

You may surprise yourself and get farther than you think.

 

[mtnbikej]

Ok, all you expert VisionQuest/CC guys.. I'm just not getting enough time to ride the big miles for CC. I been up to Santiago Peak, did the Blackstar Motorway, etc. but on different rides. Most big rides are 3-5000. yet to go over 6 thousand in one ride. Thinking I'm in over my head. I'm just gonna do it and if DNF, then so be it. Any advice? I just can't do more than one big ride a week at most.... supplement w/ doing shorter rides once or twice during the week...
Running out of time!!!

The more you ride, the stronger you will get. At this point, it's not gonna make much of a difference.

Do like Steve said.....ignore the numbers. Look more at time....that is what you are fighting against. You have 4:00 to get from Blackstar to bottom of Motorway. Realistically though, you only have 3:30. This gives you 2:30 to get up to 4 Corners. From there, you are no longer on any cutoffs. You will just have me escorting you over the Peak and down HJ(as I will be sweeping the CC).

If you can get out....get out and at least do Blackstar/Motorway....get a baseline for time. This will give you an idea of how much more you have to push, or whether you can back off a little to make the 11:30 cutoff at 4 Corners. 2:00 is a long time to get up Maple Springs.

 

[konakc]

thanks for the tips, mentally helpful about breaking things down to little segments. I had no problem w/ blackstar motorway.. and maple springs to the peak... now just have to do it in one ride!

 

[mtnbikej]

thanks for the tips, mentally helpful about breaking things down to little segments. I had no problem w/ blackstar motorway.. and maple springs to the peak... now just have to do it in one ride!

And there in lies the challenge.

 

[jasonmason]

Thanks for the recommendations guys! Especially the Jabberwocky, I'd totally forgotten about Vassago.

I've never spend much time on any Kona and they're not as common up here for some reason, but I'll check out that Big Unit. Hanzo looked a little slack for how I want to ride it, I'd forgotten about the Unit.

Niner SIR has always been a consideration, I just have this thing about EBBs...if it started creaking it would drive me nuts.

I'm really hoping Salsa is easy to deal with paying me off for the frame. This is the first time I've had to deal with warrantying a frame.

 

[jasonmason]

Duplicate, sorry

 

[jasonmason]

My advice would be to go out, don't look at the Garmin, and just think about getting to the next segment... Staying within your abilities and pace. I break things down mentally, and think of it as a lot of little rides, and not one big one. Black Star gate to gate, Doppler to Hagador, Pleasants to Motorway, Maple Pavement, Maple dirt, Chunky stuff to Modjeska, Saddle cruise, Push to the peak, Main Divide DH, etc... All of those are easy by themselves.

You may surprise yourself and get farther than you think.

I'll third this advice. It's real easy to get way too 'in your head' on race day when you're looking at the numbers.

Ride your own pace...just remember that it is a race, and there are cutoffs. If you're feeling good, especially on the middle sections, push a little harder. Don't blow yourself up, but if you're at 7, go to 8.

Regarding short vs long rides - at this point, ride what you can. If you can do 1 long and 2-3 shorter, that's a whole lot better than no long rides. Pick up your pace a little more, ride is a slightly taller gear, pay attention to little things like efficiency of movement. There's a lot more to training than just banging out long miles.

Good luck!

 

[kioti]

thanks for the tips, mentally helpful about breaking things down to little segments. I had no problem w/ blackstar motorway.. and maple springs to the peak... now just have to do it in one ride!

Before the event: Make sure your bike's in good shape and go as light as you can. Be proficient in fixing minor problems like flats or broken chain, and carry the necessary gear.

If possible, get a good night's sleep 2 nights before the event. Then, have everything organized and ready the night before for a stress-free morning.

Be hydrated before you start and try to stay that way. I recommend Tailwind (or similar drink mix) for liquid, calories and cramp management.

Stay calm, climb at a comfortable pace and rest on the descents.

Focus on forward progress, especially at aid stations. It's easy to lose valuable minutes refilling water bladder, chatting, whatever. You won't get them back. As @jasonmason says, efficiency of movement is your friend.

Have fun out there, be safe, and enjoy the day!

 

[Faust29]

I'm really hoping Salsa is easy to deal with paying me off for the frame. This is the first time I've had to deal with warrantying a frame.

I bought the Salsa from The Path, so they dealt with Salsa for me. The only thing Salsa wanted was proof that the frame was destroyed by the shop, so it couldn't be "fixed". They cut the bottom bracket out and sent Salsa a picture.

 

[MegaLurker]

Thanks for the recommendations guys! Especially the Jabberwocky, I'd totally forgotten about Vassago.

I've never spend much time on any Kona and they're not as common up here for some reason, but I'll check out that Big Unit. Hanzo looked a little slack for how I want to ride it, I'd forgotten about the Unit.

Niner SIR has always been a consideration, I just have this thing about EBBs...if it started creaking it would drive me nuts.

I'm really hoping Salsa is easy to deal with paying me off for the frame. This is the first time I've had to deal with warrantying a frame.

I can vouch for Vassago... I've been rolling a VerHauen for the last 3 months. Good ride, but still taking some getting used to after riding carbon for the last 5 years.

 

[MegaLurker]

thanks for the tips, mentally helpful about breaking things down to little segments. I had no problem w/ blackstar motorway.. and maple springs to the peak... now just have to do it in one ride!

In the 2 CCs, and 2 VQs I've done, I've never ridden anything longer than Blackstar Motorway, or Maple (or Harding) to the Peak for a training ride. While I wasn't quite keeping up with Tinker and Dana, I was able to finish all within my goal. I was worried for both VQs as both times I was traveling for business (like fly in the night before, and fly back out that night), and could barely limp along to Motorway the weekend before. However, there is something about race day... the excitement at the start, people cheering along up Maple/4C, and by the time I was heading up Trabuco I was too far in to turn around... before I knew it, it was over.

My only 2 rules:

• Dont get caught in the race to Beeks (learned that the hard way during my first VQ, set a PR that still stands, and paid for it the rest of the day).
• Walking is ok, especially on a SS - getting passed on Main Divide is never easy... but no one will remember you walking up the wall before Hagador Peak. learned that one the hard way too.

Good luck!

 

[Runs with Scissors]

Humility is your friend, and walking is ok - getting passed on Main Divide is never easy... but not one will remember you walking up the wall before Hagador Peak.

Darn good thing I gave up my ego years ago. Life is so much easier now.

 

[Runs with Scissors]

You have 4:00 to get from Blackstar to bottom of Motorway. Realistically though, you only have 3:30. This gives you 2:30 to get up to 4 Corners. From there, you are no longer on any cutoffs.... 2:00 is a long time to get up Maple Springs.

So with a time of 3:37 (total, not just moving) from the tree farm to bottom of Motorway, you're saying I woulda had a shot at doing the CC???? Dang!!

Maybe I need to seriously consider giving it a shot next year.

 

[singlespeedrider]

Not racing up to beeks is a tough one. I set a pr almost every time I have done VQ.

One climb at a time and don't forget the burger at the top of wht.

 

[mtnbikej]

So with a time of 3:37 (total, not just moving) from the tree farm to bottom of Motorway, you're saying I woulda had a shot at doing the CC???? Dang!!

Maybe I need to seriously consider giving it a shot next year.

Well, you would have been quicker....you don't stop on event day....you always move forward, whether pedaling or walking. You also gotta take 4 mins off that time since you started at the Tree Farm.