Unsafe rider encounter. 01-24-2018

  • Thread starter Thread starter dustyyoungblood
  • Start date Start date
blixet said:
Been in the same spot, figuratively, and know the feelings you have had well. Glad nothing really happened. From my experience, other than the jolt from being startled and the judgement of all wrong, it's no harm no foul and at least first time around best to let it go and not hold onto it. I can only control my behavior, I retired from being in charge of others.
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I agree. He saw a place to pass, but the gap closed before he got thru. He didnt hit you or make anyone crash. You dont know if there was a spot to pass, you didnt even know he was back there.
Everyone has a different reaction to being surprised by a pass, look at the hikers who jump out of their skin when you make a safe pass by them. Your riding buds may be like them, reacting to the surprise and not the actual pass/safety of the pass.
And he apologized, so there's that.
Other than him not calling out, no blood, no foul.
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scottay said:
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I agree. He saw a place to pass, but the gap closed before he got thru. He didnt hit you or make anyone crash. You dont know if there was a spot to pass, you didnt even know he was back there.
Everyone has a different reaction to being surprised by a pass, look at the hikers who jump out of their skin when you make a safe pass by them. Your riding buds may be like them, reacting to the surprise and not the actual pass/safety of the pass.
And he apologized, so there's that.
Other than him not calling out, no blood, no foul.
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Sure fair enough. Like I said, if it was only him coming under my wheel and backing off I would blow it off. I can handle it. I raced in the velodrome as a teenager and have zero problems leaning in elbow to elbow.

But 3 other buddies had a similar reaction. “That guy in the green almost took me out never heard him coming”, “he passed me on the fire road with no notice and an inch from my bars”, “that guy in the green nearly clipped me, what a jerk”
 
I don't know if it's the "I'm training!" mentality or the pack mentality of belonging to a club and wearing the kit, but I've certainly noticed that people wearing team kit are more than likely to be at the very least unfriendly and at worst complete jerks - some kits moreso than others (not counting Linked among those...but there are a couple of teams whose members seem to be predominantly jerkish). But even in a race I'm going to call out before I pass somebody (granted, that's not a common occurrence - some guys' voices might get hoarse), so I don't get not calling out or dinging a bell on a regular ride, training or not.

That said, does anyone know of local teams/clubs that are easygoing and welcome slow, fat guys? I was in the best shape of my life when I belonged to a club (kinda fell into it - long story) and would like to get back there. Group training rides have a way of making you work harder.
 
BigTex said:
I don't know if it's the "I'm training!" mentality or the pack mentality of belonging to a club and wearing the kit, but I've certainly noticed that people wearing team kit are more than likely to be at the very least unfriendly and at worst complete jerks - some kits moreso than others (not counting Linked among those...but there are a couple of teams whose members seem to be predominantly jerkish). But even in a race I'm going to call out before I pass somebody (granted, that's not a common occurrence - some guys' voices might get hoarse), so I don't get not calling out or dinging a bell on a regular ride, training or not.

That said, does anyone know of local teams/clubs that are easygoing and welcome slow, fat guys? I was in the best shape of my life when I belonged to a club (kinda fell into it - long story) and would like to get back there. Group training rides have a way of making you work harder.
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Richard, I live in Ladera and my loose knit "club" is called the "Gear grinders" PM me for contact info sir.
 
BigTex said:
I don't know if it's the "I'm training!" mentality or the pack mentality of belonging to a club and wearing the kit, but I've certainly noticed that people wearing team kit are more than likely to be at the very least unfriendly and at worst complete jerks - some kits moreso than others (not counting Linked among those...but there are a couple of teams whose members seem to be predominantly jerkish). But even in a race I'm going to call out before I pass somebody (granted, that's not a common occurrence - some guys' voices might get hoarse), so I don't get not calling out or dinging a bell on a regular ride, training or not.
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BigTex FTWx2. Where uniforms come, trouble follows.

BigTex said:
That said, does anyone know of local teams/clubs that are easygoing and welcome slow, fat guys? I was in the best shape of my life when I belonged to a club (kinda fell into it - long story) and would like to get back there. Group training rides have a way of making you work harder.
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I think this is that group, Tex. :geek: Maybe not as regimented or populous as you'd like. But I will say these dirtheads have a penchant for inadvertent motivational consultation...their stoke has a time-release effect that can keep ya fired up until the next infusion. You know who you are... :sneaky::cool::thumbsup: Here's to climbing back up, Tex.
 
BigTex said:
That said, does anyone know of local teams/clubs that are easygoing and welcome slow, fat guys? I was in the best shape of my life when I belonged to a club (kinda fell into it - long story) and would like to get back there. Group training rides have a way of making you work harder.
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These guys seem kinda' nice:

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BigTex said:
I don't know if it's the "I'm training!" mentality or the pack mentality of belonging to a club and wearing the kit, but I've certainly noticed that people wearing team kit are more than likely to be at the very least unfriendly and at worst complete jerks - some kits moreso than others (not counting Linked among those...but there are a couple of teams whose members seem to be predominantly jerkish). But even in a race I'm going to call out before I pass somebody (granted, that's not a common occurrence - some guys' voices might get hoarse), so I don't get not calling out or dinging a bell on a regular ride, training or not.

That said, does anyone know of local teams/clubs that are easygoing and welcome slow, fat guys? I was in the best shape of my life when I belonged to a club (kinda fell into it - long story) and would like to get back there. Group training rides have a way of making you work harder.
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Agree. The guys I’ve seen who scream at people to move over during OTH races have all been wearing “team” kits. The dork who couldn’t handle the mud up Black Star during Counting Coup last year and had to let his “teammates” along with anyone else within earshot know that he “has bigger and better races to deal with” as he stomped off back down the trail was in a team kit. Maybe it’s the personality type of someone who wants to belong on such a team but I do see a common theme and apparently so do others.

I get it, you race.. awesome, now stop sounding like a vegan cross fitter by letting the whole world know that you are a “racer” at every opportunity you get. (Sorry for the ranting tangent)
 
Cornholio said:
Agree. The guys I’ve seen who scream at people to move over during OTH races have all been wearing “team” kits. The dork who couldn’t handle the mud up Black Star during Counting Coup last year and had to let his “teammates” along with anyone else within earshot know that he “has bigger and better races to deal with” as he stomped off back down the trail was in a team kit. Maybe it’s the personality type of someone who wants to belong on such a team but I do see a common theme and apparently so do others.

I get it, you race.. awesome, now stop sounding like a vegan cross fitter by letting the whole world know that you are a “racer” at every opportunity you get. (Sorry for the ranting tangent)
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5da104d0ecfd0ccb2076f8e3053647a2.jpg
 
I race for fun and motivation. Only a D when I speak. Very polite on the trails. All types of folks on this planet. Hard enough to change ourselves let alone change others. He doesn't know he is a D and wouldn't believe you if you told him most likely.
 
Cornholio said:
Agree. The guys I’ve seen who scream at people to move over during OTH races have all been wearing “team” kits. The dork who couldn’t handle the mud up Black Star during Counting Coup last year and had to let his “teammates” along with anyone else within earshot know that he “has bigger and better races to deal with” as he stomped off back down the trail was in a team kit. Maybe it’s the personality type of someone who wants to belong on such a team but I do see a common theme and apparently so do others.

I get it, you race.. awesome, now stop sounding like a vegan cross fitter by letting the whole world know that you are a “racer” at every opportunity you get. (Sorry for the ranting tangent)
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I fully agree with what you are saying. Remember though, just because you have a "team kit" doesn't necessarily mean you are on that team. Any schmuck can go out and by MOST team kits.
 
BigTex said:
I've certainly noticed that people wearing team kit are more than likely to be at the very least unfriendly and at worst complete jerks
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A combination of deep-seated feelings of inadequacy mixed with compensation behavior :) I prefer to call it "little penis syndrome". As the saying goes, "the bigger the truck, the smaller the package."

If I have to wear a sign to tell people how cool or important I am... I'm probably not.
 
My first reaction is to get all defense about the team kit guys being assholes. I mean, I wear a team kit!

But then I remember, I'm an *******.

Honestly though, I do avoid certain groups, and most road riders for the pack mentality thing. I have certain roadies I'll ride with. All my MTB riding friends either aren't racers, or don't take the racing seriously.

Cyclotourist said:
These guys seem kinda' nice:

View attachment 35852
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Eh, dey ait.
 
Cornholio said:
Agree. The guys I’ve seen who scream at people to move over during OTH races have all been wearing “team” kits.
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I don't know if it's the same type of thing, I've not been to OTH. But Ben Goyette is one of the nicest guys and super polite, but he calls out loud and early when coming up on people to give them time to plan. On some of the Big Bear single track we are easily doing twice the speed of the Cat 3 people we are passing. I follow a different approach and wait until I get closer and try to call out when I know there is a safe spot for them to let me pass, often times actually saying "please let me by when it's safe".
 
Sidewalk said:
I don't know if it's the same type of thing, I've not been to OTH. But Ben Goyette is one of the nicest guys and super polite, but he calls out loud and early when coming up on people to give them time to plan. On some of the Big Bear single track we are easily doing twice the speed of the Cat 3 people we are passing. I follow a different approach and wait until I get closer and try to call out when I know there is a safe spot for them to let me pass, often times actually saying "please let me by when it's safe".
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Not the same.. talking about a section that would get a huge traffic jam which forced riders to just wait it out in line but some guys felt they had the right of way because they were serious racers in a not so serious race series. If I remember correctly the organizers even sent emails out telling the DB’s to knock it off or kick rocks.

Edit: Found the email and here’s an excerpt...

Tune us out only after you read this: Over the Hump's Rule #1 is: "HAVE FUN" if you find that beyond your ability, or beyond your ability to let others whom race, in our community, please email info@raceoth.com and we'll refund the remainder of your season that's been paid. Then the rest of us will get on with the party. Trust me! We'll all be better without you. (We're sure there is a place for those people, and surely it's not Over the Hump).

So, simply put:

  • Communicate on the course COURTEOUSLY
  • Ride within your own control, ANTICIPATING OTH racers are accross the spectrum skill wise
  • When stuck in a potential bottle neck wait it out, Seriously, you live in SoCal, that's not traffic...you've seen traffic
  • If you are uber serious about winning the series, you've got bets on it, and bragging rights are on the line, it's the only acheivemet youve put on your calendar this year, etc, etc, go race on STRAVA! Not HERE! You'll be winner evertime.
1-10 racers ruinning a week for 500 really isn't good odds on who wins in the long run. Look, it's not that we don't value your ability to race! Race your heart out, exhaust yourelf pedaling BUT when it comes down to being human vs. canabal racers: have a heart. We will ask problem prone racers to leave if similar primitive behavior continues on week 2 and beyond (Because of some first time racers feedback - The OTH "fun flag" was at half mast on Wednesday due to a small small minority).

 
I contacted Josh at linked cycling about this incident. I did not disclose the riders name, but asked instead that the club simply remind members to use appropriate caution when training for whiting TT. Sharing his great email here:

Dustan

Thank you very much for reaching out and notifying us of this issue that occurred with one of our riders. We do try to make it a point ensuring that our riders are thoughtful, considerate, and respectful on the trail. We appreciate the notice that you have had of our group in general in the cycling community, but also realize that this means we are being watched. First and foremost we are representative ambassadors for Jesus Christ and that also brings forth a level of scrutinizing which all of us should be aware of and ready for.

Again thank you for notifying us of this and rest assured that we would send a notification via our communication methods to our members as well as those associated with Linked Cycling.

You did mention that you did a quick check and that the rider is registered for the Whiting TT. Would you mind sharing with us who this particular individual is so that we may have an appropriate discussion directly with the individual to ensure they are aware of our stance and importance of this subject.

P.S. We would love for you to join us on a ride sometime. Let us know if you would like any detailed information about our rides, etc.

Kind Regards

Josh Kompa
Linked Cycling Leadership

"I am writing to your club as a fellow OC MTB enthusiast with a great deal of respect for your club and everything your members have accomplished on the bike. I am reaching out and hoping that you may find it a good idea to send a very friendly reminder email to your club members to use proper trail etiquette and safety when training for the Whiting ranch TT coming up soon. Earlier this week a linked cycling member made or attempted unsafe passes on 4 separate riders heading DH in whiting ranch. All 4 times none of the riders heard any announcement, bell, or warning to indicate a rider approaching. While I am completely comfortable being passed in close quarters, its basic safety to make an announcement if you want to pass. Additionally the section of trail That I was attempted to be passed on was NOT a reasonable area to pass. simpley not any room and not safe. After coming inside my wheel the rider had to abandon his attempt and fall back untill a wider section appeared ahead. While one isolated is no big deal, after speaking with the 3 others that had similar incidents that day it was apparent that the problem could be systemic and might warrant a friendly chat with the individual next time I see him. A quick check shows he is registered for the Whiting TT and I hope that this one day he let his training get into his head and forgot about basic county park riding etiquette. Do you think you could make a group email to your club or post to your facebook group to use just a little more caution on trail areas that are not a closed race course? Cheers and best wishes, DB"
 
Cornholio said:
Not the same.. talking about a section that would get a huge traffic jam which forced riders to just wait it out in line but some guys felt they had the right of way because they were serious racers in a not so serious race series.
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Oh, yeah, I know the exact type of thing you are talking about. I had this happen several times in the Temecula races. One particular instance when we all got log jammed up the bridges switchback climb at Temecula during a 12 hour. It was just a long line of people walking up. But people would roll up and try to run passed people. I yelled at a couple to get back in line.

I could be wrong, but I think I won overall that day. So not being an ass didn't hurt me.
 
dustyyoungblood said:
I contacted Josh at linked cycling about this incident. I did not disclose the riders name, but asked instead that the club simply remind members to use appropriate caution when training for whiting TT. Sharing his great email here:

Dustan

Thank you very much for reaching out and notifying us of this issue that occurred with one of our riders. We do try to make it a point ensuring that our riders are thoughtful, considerate, and respectful on the trail. We appreciate the notice that you have had of our group in general in the cycling community, but also realize that this means we are being watched. First and foremost we are representative ambassadors for Jesus Christ and that also brings forth a level of scrutinizing which all of us should be aware of and ready for.

Again thank you for notifying us of this and rest assured that we would send a notification via our communication methods to our members as well as those associated with Linked Cycling.

You did mention that you did a quick check and that the rider is registered for the Whiting TT. Would you mind sharing with us who this particular individual is so that we may have an appropriate discussion directly with the individual to ensure they are aware of our stance and importance of this subject.

P.S. We would love for you to join us on a ride sometime. Let us know if you would like any detailed information about our rides, etc.

Kind Regards

Josh Kompa
Linked Cycling Leadership

"I am writing to your club as a fellow OC MTB enthusiast with a great deal of respect for your club and everything your members have accomplished on the bike. I am reaching out and hoping that you may find it a good idea to send a very friendly reminder email to your club members to use proper trail etiquette and safety when training for the Whiting ranch TT coming up soon. Earlier this week a linked cycling member made or attempted unsafe passes on 4 separate riders heading DH in whiting ranch. All 4 times none of the riders heard any announcement, bell, or warning to indicate a rider approaching. While I am completely comfortable being passed in close quarters, its basic safety to make an announcement if you want to pass. Additionally the section of trail That I was attempted to be passed on was NOT a reasonable area to pass. simpley not any room and not safe. After coming inside my wheel the rider had to abandon his attempt and fall back untill a wider section appeared ahead. While one isolated is no big deal, after speaking with the 3 others that had similar incidents that day it was apparent that the problem could be systemic and might warrant a friendly chat with the individual next time I see him. A quick check shows he is registered for the Whiting TT and I hope that this one day he let his training get into his head and forgot about basic county park riding etiquette. Do you think you could make a group email to your club or post to your facebook group to use just a little more caution on trail areas that are not a closed race course? Cheers and best wishes, DB"
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Nicely written Dustan, and thanks for sharing the reply.
 
Dusty, great job of taking the high road. :thumbsup:

The reply was not a denial, but it sure is chock full of weirdness. Condition the response with a statement about faith? Like that has anything to do with it. "Being watched?" "Would" send out a notice to members (under what conditions?). And BTW, which member of ours should we skewer for this infraction? Wanna ride with us? :eek:
 
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