Specialized Turbo Levo FSR Expert

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DangerDirtyD said:
Sometimes while riding my road bike and sharing the road with automobiles, I find myself thinking what dipshifts drivers are for hauling all that unnecessary equipment and material to get to where they are going.
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I'm loosely quoting BikeSnobNYC who said something like, awesome to add a motor to a bike. Maybe a locking box to store things as well. How about having a windshield to make it rideable year round!!! Now about doors, to further keep the elements out and add security. Maybe extra wheels to keep it stable and let the elderly & infirm use it.
And at that point, you have a car.
 
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me neither..
just came back from midday Santiago ride. only one other rider, bunch of red tipped vultures, nice old man hiker...
chutes was so nice had to ride it twice!
 
dstepper said:
I am not the one that said I would not ride with someone that rode a certain type of bike. I just overreacted because I thought that was very narrow minded. For years I have rode the social trails all over the west pushing the limits of want might considered illegal. People pick and choice which laws they obey. Lots of folks smoke pot against the law, cheat on taxes, drive with illegal BAC. Those are felony's and misdemeanors that do not come close to a citation for illegal trail use. I really don’t care if people accept what I do or not, I am willing to pay the consequences of my actions. If those consequences means certain people will not ride with me so be it. I ride 90% of the time alone anyway. Not one of my friends have been anything but welcoming me back after my injuries, e-bike or not, and have been supportive of me getting back on the trail with them after a year abstinence .

Just for clarification: e-bike is one of 9 bikes in my garage and not the only bike I use. I still ride my single speed and the bike I ride the most is a fully rigid 11 speed. I am one of the rare MTBers that don't even mind sharing trails with motos and horses. I like them out there on remote rides.

Dean
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I'll ride with you on an ebike, but you could get bored.
 
dstepper said:
The e-bike threads on MTBer are asking that the moderators get rid of the ebike forum.

I will not bring up the subject and if anyone wants to private message me I will help. I only respond to posts already started. The division is so great that Mikie should just start deleting all ebike threads and post PM Dean. Or make a invitation only forum and appoint a moderator.

Dean
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Keep this up. I'd rather see Ebikes than Motos any day.
 
I enjoy e-MTB's, but they seem to initiate contentious arguments on MTB forums. Since we're probably not going to have threads on DIY or which bike clicks all the boxes (for some time), probably best to eschew them. Also, possible to give the anti-MTB group(s) some free ammo with some of the comments.
 
Mikie said:
I personally do not wish to ever ride with someone on an E-Bike. It would suck all the joy out of my hard efforts and years of training towards fitness and personal achievement. It would be miserable and demoralizing for me to have to experience that. I personally will stay with my own kind in that regard, and I mean that sincerely, not negatively.
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I think I get your thinking here. It's like that GEICO commercial where the group of Antarctic explorers finally reach the South Pole after months of arduous struggle only to find those dopey cartoon characters already there and asking "What took you so long?" The explorers throw down their gear and sadly walk away. Let me offer a more positive and inclusive perspective.

The existence of e-bikes should never rob you or any 100% human-powered mountain biker of the joy of a great ride, the relationships developed from riding or diminish your hard efforts for fitness and achieving personal goals. Even if an e-biker is the first to the top, that e-biker can never claim that he rode that climb entirely under his own power. You can make that claim regardless of the time differential with the e-biker. It's like Barry Bonds' home run record. There will always be an asterisk by his number because he used artificial performance enhancers. Hank Aaron hit fewer home runs but he did it with his own unaltered and unassisted natural abilities so he will always be the home run champ in my book.

E-bikes are artificial performance enhancers! Unlike steroids they are not harmful to the user. There is a big question about the potential threat to trail access posed by the increasing use of e-bikes which is my only concern about them. Lots of people have very legitimate reasons for riding e-bikes and anyone has the right to ride them if they choose. I would have no problem riding with anyone who rides an e-bike. Heck, I'm usually the last guy to the top anyway but I will still ride with faster 100% human powered bikers; as long as they wait for me occasionally of course:thumbsup:! Riding with an e-biker would not steal my joy or mess with my mojo in any way. In fact, like Wheezy's riding buddies did, I'd give the e-biker a little good-natured crap for his assisted riding!

So I'd suggest for us 100% human powered people to lighten up a little. Some good people ride e-bikes either by choice or necessity so where they are legal, share the trail with e-bikes and enjoy their company like you would any other mtb'r. Remember, there will be a day when all of us 100%'rs will not be able to do this as we do now. When that day comes for me, I will gladly purchase an e-bike so I can extend my mountain bike years as long as possible and I'd still like to ride with other people:inlove:!
 
Maddog said:
I think I get your thinking here. It's like that GEICO commercial where the group of Antarctic explorers finally reach the South Pole after months of arduous struggle only to find those dopey cartoon characters already there and asking "What took you so long?" The explorers throw down their gear and sadly walk away. Let me offer a more positive and inclusive perspective.

The existence of e-bikes should never rob you or any 100% human-powered mountain biker of the joy of a great ride, the relationships developed from riding or diminish your hard efforts for fitness and achieving personal goals. Even if an e-biker is the first to the top, that e-biker can never claim that he rode that climb entirely under his own power. You can make that claim regardless of the time differential with the e-biker. It's like Barry Bonds' home run record. There will always be an asterisk by his number because he used artificial performance enhancers. Hank Aaron hit fewer home runs but he did it with his own unaltered and unassisted natural abilities so he will always be the home run champ in my book.

E-bikes are artificial performance enhancers! Unlike steroids they are not harmful to the user. There is a big question about the potential threat to trail access posed by the increasing use of e-bikes which is my only concern about them. Lots of people have very legitimate reasons for riding e-bikes and anyone has the right to ride them if they choose. I would have no problem riding with anyone who rides an e-bike. Heck, I'm usually the last guy to the top anyway but I will still ride with faster 100% human powered bikers; as long as they wait for me occasionally of course:thumbsup:! Riding with an e-biker would not steal my joy or mess with my mojo in any way. In fact, like Wheezy's riding buddies did, I'd give the e-biker a little good-natured crap for his assisted riding!

So I'd suggest for us 100% human powered people to lighten up a little. Some good people ride e-bikes either by choice or necessity so where they are legal, share the trail with e-bikes and enjoy their company like you would any other mtb'r. Remember, there will be a day when all of us 100%'rs will not be able to do this as we do now. When that day comes for me, I will gladly purchase an e-bike so I can extend my mountain bike years as long as possible and I'd still like to ride with other people:inlove:!
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Well said.
 
It's impossible to know how this'll all shake out over the next decade or two, but one can only hope for the best--whatever that is. Many of us with reservations about battery-assisted bikes are extremely grateful for the current state of affairs, knowing mountain bikers could easily be excluded from many of the trail systems we currently enjoy. The access battles were won largely because we ride human-powered bikes. With motorized assistance now available, our arguments will be harder to legitimize, IMO, and we may lose access. Scarcity of trails in urban and populated areas will only exacerbate the issue. NEPA law and other environmental protections will also act as a barricade to building new trails for all of us, not to mention battery-assisted bicyclists.

My girlfriend and I were in Bend OR last week, which has been hailed as a destination resort for many sports and activities, as well as a "best place to live" in tons of magazines and web reviews. In fact, we'd been interested in moving there for decades. But the quiet little town we remembered is gone, and traffic and new housing have it looking (to us) like a clone of Orange County. Articles in their local paper complain about tourism and tourism's negative impacts. But isn't all the self-promotion they've needed to survive one of primary reasons they've lost the small town, quiet feeling many people moved there to find?

Obviously what works for one person doesn't work for another, and many people will enjoy Bend as it is, with all the micro-breweries and commerce and everything else. And that's great, because there's much to love.

But those of us who grew up before battery-assisted bikes found lots to love about facing and conquering challenges while riding under our own power. That may change and a future generation may not experience it at all. For many of us, that would be loss as to what it means to be human. For others, it may prove to be irrelevant.

The operative word is hope, that is, I hope the avenues available for the pursuit of happiness expand proportionately to the increasing number of humans on the planet, and I also hope they are able to find joy in simple ways and in natural surroundings; unplugged from the embrace of technology and occasionally standing naked and strong beneath a dark and constellation-filled sky.
 
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I grew up during a time when many small and medium sized logging towns in Mendocino went from thriving small communities to nothing. Changes in laws pushed logging jobs out of California mills closed. On the coast those that made a living fishing commercially lost everything, again laws changed. Nothing stays the same. I would give anything to have the ranch I once owned back but I lost it when I lost working in the woods. Some progress is good others maybe not so good, the only change constant is change.

I have not been to Bend since 1969 and hate to hear that it has changed so much. On the other hand I know of a dozens of small towns in Northern CA that have seen none to little change. What is the point? I just try to live and let live and don't worry much about the little stuff. E-Bike is deep into the little stuff.

Want to try a place to live that does not change try Kenndy Meadows, Troy Meadows BlackRock station area.

Dean
 
dstepper said:
..What is the point? I just try to live and let live and don't worry much about the little stuff. E-Bike is deep into the little stuff. Dean
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The point is, I don't want the actions of our generation(s) to cause outcomes that rob future generations of the opportunity to participate in the things we love and treasure.

And so called "little stuff" can have big consequences.
 
Bummer to read the site owner feels this way. As a father of a young son, 15, who has complicated health issues that prevent him from putting forth an extraneous effort into any physically demanding activity, I'm bummed but this is America and like Colin Kaepernick, were entitled to our own opinions and preferences. Enjoy the trails; I know I will..with my son.
 
kioti said:
The point is, I don't want the actions of our generation(s) to cause outcomes that rob future generations of the opportunity to participate in the things we love and treasure.

And so called "little stuff" can have big consequences.
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Generations to come can pick for themselves. The traditional bikes aren't going anywhere anytime soon. The act of creating e-bikes is bringing more people to the sport therefore exposing them to mountain biking as you and I know. I'd say our actions are only helping the future generation of mountain bikers.

For the record I don't own an e-bike nor plan on it but if makes people happy to get out and ride the trails(e-bikes are allowed to be on) then the sport will continue to flourish.
 
Will Cruise said:
Bummer to read the site owner feels this way. As a father of a young son, 15, who has complicated health issues that prevent him from putting forth an extraneous effort into any physically demanding activity, I'm bummed but this is America and like Colin Kaepernick, were entitled to our own opinions and preferences. Enjoy the trails; I know I will..with my son.
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As easy as it is on a Forum, words can be taken out of context (I'm not talking intentionally) or do not explain every aspect of the scenario...
First it concerns me when a comment like above refers to me as the site owner and equates my opinion as the sites opinion. Far from the truth. Everybody gets to have an opinion, I have one and just happen to be the site owner, there is a huge difference. Many Forums out there are open for "business" and the Forum Owner is just that... the Forum Owner.

I am passionate about all aspects of Mountain Biking. To the point I started a Mountain Bike Forum. For a small Forum there is a lot of MTB stoke! I would like to think that I bring some of that stoke to the table.

Nothing has been more dividing, more passionate driven, and has caused the most frustration and dissention then the debate about e-bikes. It's left me concerned about how to handle it as a Forum Owner. I obviously have my opinions, but I want to do what's right for the forum, despite my opinion.

There is talk out there about banning e-bike discussions on other forums for the very same reasons here. No compromise and a touchy subject. And without stirring a new debate on mountain bike "unity", the one vision I DO have for this site is unity and respect.

I'm not one to run from issues, but I think I am going to try my hardest to refrain from commenting on e-bikes anymore. My comments, concerns, and statements are very clear throughout ALL the e-bike posts, and all I have done is repeat over and over and over my thoughts on the subject. I'm going to treat this like politics... Your friendship is more important then that!

Cornholio said:
Geez.. The guy has an opinion, let it go. I don't know @Mikie but he comes off as a pretty warm and accepting guy to me and I do want to ride with him and anyone else on here in the future.
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I really appreciate this... Sincerely B.
No one can go around saying, "Hey, I'm a good dude." But I hope my reputation proceeds me...;)
 
"I really do believe there is zero reasons this bike shouldn't be allowed on every single trail that a regular mountain bike is allowed on and there is nothing that will change that opinion. Feel free to hate away!" Wheezy from his "Haters gonna hate" thread.

Wheezy, not only do you have a right to your opinion, but unlike most of your fellow riders, you probably have a legal right to ride one of these bikes on non-motorized trails. So why frame it like anyone who disagrees with you is a hater? Just get a handicap placard and clear it with the Ranger or land manager where you're riding. Then ride responsibly and be grateful there's an option for you to compensate for your disability. As noted before, there's virtually no opposition to your (or others like Will Cruise's son) being able to use technology to access and enjoy trails otherwise designated non-motorized.

The differences of opinion some of us have are not "hate" and I feel it's disrespectful to call them that. I'm personally glad you have an option to keep doing what you love doing, and I'm glad that disability laws allow for it.
 
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kioti said:
The operative word is hope, that is, I hope the avenues available for the pursuit of happiness expand proportionately to the increasing number of humans on the planet, and I also hope they are able to find joy in simple ways and in natural surroundings; unplugged from the embrace of technology and occasionally standing naked and strong beneath a dark and constellation-filled sky.
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What you describe here regarding avenues of happiness, unfortunately, are drugs and video games. We are doomed Mr. Tambourine Man.
 
kioti said:
The point is, I don't want the actions of our generation(s) to cause outcomes that rob future generations of the opportunity to participate in the things we love and treasure.

And so called "little stuff" can have big consequences.
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I believe that MTBers turning against each other will have more of a negative effect on trail access issues that e-bikers actually using the trails. We all should just keep it to ourselves keep the discussions off public forums and let the land managers figure this one out. They will be using our arguments not just against e-bikers but all MTBers.

We all know that land managers rarely spend time out on the trails checking things out but I know they scour these forum and Strava looking for illegal activity.

Dean
 
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dstepper said:
I believe that MTBers turning against each other will have more of a negative effect on trail access issues that e-bikers actually using the trails. We all should just keep it to ourselves keep the discussions off public forums and let the land managers figure this one out. They will be using our arguments not just against e-bikers but all MTBers.

We all know that land managers really spend time out on the trails checking things out but I know they scour these forum and Strava looking for poachers.

Dean
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This is why i don't like the ebike. Those heavy batteries are getting on board and sinking our MTB ship.
 
dstepper said:
I believe that MTBers turning against each other will have more of a negative effect on trail access issues that e-bikers actually using the trails. We all should just keep it to ourselves keep the discussions off public forums and let the land managers figure this one out. They will be using our arguments not just against e-bikers but all MTBers.

We all know that land managers really spend time out on the trails checking things out but I know they scour these forum and Strava looking for illegal activity.

Dean
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Quoted for the truth. Couldn't have said it better myself. The masses (and uneducated) do not have a concept of the term "synergy". Promoting a synergistic environment where every idea and opinion is heard and considered is the gateway to opening doors to new opportunities.
 
DangerDirtyD said:
What you describe here regarding avenues of happiness, unfortunately, are drugs and video games. We are doomed Mr. Tambourine Man.
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Absolutley the honest truth! Taking good care of oneself is the only tride and true way to feel good, I've sooo been on the other side! Nope! Life isn't fair, try as we may to even the score with our compromise. Strong is strong , weak is weak. Sorry if the truth is the truth. :) Really, it all comes down to what kind of shape your mental health is in. Life is a battle!
 
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