Glenn Ranch Parking Lot Tunnel and Edison Barbwired again

mtbfan said:
Also, if you take the dirt trail that parallels the church and goes up that quick steep hill and under the tollroad, you will see signs that say "Aliso Creek Trail". Those signs even point up the next rocky section that gets you to the top. Nowhere does it say that the "Aliso Creek Trail" ends. So, you are allowed to enter from that side, but not from the other?
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I typically exit on that road that parallels the church as I get fun semi rocky descent, then up through SB parking lot. I haven't ridden up that little hill but a couple times, but it's a reasonable bypass. before they built the homes, there was a fun short ST that went that way then they blocked and messed it up, most likely by Mike Vandermen fans. There are a few roads ( almost ST now) that go by the towers that I do circles on occasionally. but climbing up the loose gravel rocks I find can be challenging at times.
And I think that road is acceptable as most Likely not part of the other plot. Anyway, dirt over pavement/cars always. So much safer and fun!
 
mtbfan said:
Update - Just got a call back from the Southwest Resource Management and here is what they said: "We own the Portola South Property in Lake Forest. We got that donated to us several years ago. It is under the purview of the US Fish and Wildlife Service. It is a conservation property, and that's why we had to close the trails, to keep the mountainbikers out because they are destroying the habitat, and we have had some problems with them vandalizing and cutting our signs and generally being kind of a problem. Unfortunately, that's changed. It's not public property, it's a piece of private property. I think when under Edison, it was also private property, but the let things go on. But that has changed now. We are a non profit organization and own and manage 1000s of acres. We are under Federal and State regulations we have to follow." He left an e-mail, so I sent him a long message, explaining that the mountainbikers are obviously not the ones destroying Nature Habitat and that it is the greedy developers who have no concern for nature or the animals.
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You might also ask him why, if they own the property, the Orange County Tax Assessor's Office still shows it as being owned by Edison.
 
Here is the response from the Southwest Resource Management: "
I understand your frustration and having used the site for many years to ride. Although other parcels have been developed, those were not saved and conserved for open space and species mitigation as was this old Edison parcel. There are a few trails that are outside of our property that can be ridden on, but the problem comes with mountain bike riders who make new trails off the roads and into the habitat. We have been blocking trails only to have our fence cut and brush removed to make more trails.



The trails cause erosion and sedimentation and remove vegetation that keeps soil in place. I have attached an aerial that shows the trails and a photo with erosion taking place because of them. While you and your contacts may not be the ones cutting trails, there are many who do, so we have to block it to all riders. While it’s difficult to stop trespass completely, we will be working with local law enforcement and have a ranger that is there each week. Under state and federal law, the site is a conservation property that was set aside to conserve the open space from development like you stated. You are correct in that we are in a situation where the state wants housing for all the new population coming in from all over, but where and how do you do that with limited resources?. Yet developers are asked to build more homes to house people on land that needs conservation. Its an issue we have been dealing with for decades.



While most users stay on the road, we have to limit or prevent access into the habitat because of our permit requirements under US Fish and Wildlife Service and state Fish and Game laws. We cant have violations of our permit because people want to make trails. The site is not public property so we have different remedies depending on the situation. There are some species of animals that are tolerant of humans and human activity, but we are not working with those. It’s the open space that is being conserved so the species come along with it. The trails along the power lines are not on our property, so those we have no control over and can be used as long as Edison allows it."

I attached the PDF. Can someone identify which trails these are? Also, if the trails along the power lines are ok to ride, how does the barbwire at the tunnel to Glenn Ranch fit it?
 

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Those trails have been there for a very long time. Most of those were cut/ridden on the old oakley rides that used to take place. I don't know of any of the shredders that are still frequenting these or riding them... it's likely down to kids in the neighborhood or kids on surrons.
 
mtbfan said:
I attached the PDF. Can someone identify which trails these are? Also, if the trails along the power lines are ok to ride, how does the barbwire at the tunnel to Glenn Ranch fit it?
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Having ridden the Edison Viejo trail one billion times (yes, it has a name, and is on the Orange County list of regional trails) the PDF is showing a small sub-segment of the property, and some of the unofficial single track trails that people have been riding for decades. I understand his position that he doesn't like the unofficial single track trails - but what is his response to barbed wire fencing that cuts off the TRUCK TRAIL that Edison uses to service its towers - and which bikers use to connect the two trail systems?

Here is a Google map image of the property - without lines drawn on it. Notice the TRUCK TRAILS? His PDF is of a small segment of this property (you can see it by the dry wash) and he had to draw lines on it because you can't see it in Google maps. He is NOT talking about the obvious trails in this image - but rather he is justifying stringing barbed wire fencing to keep people out of the scrub...


trails.jpg
 
And I just want to say - this guy is talking out of both sides of his mouth. It is their property? Or isn't it? What is this "We cant have violations of our permit because people want to make trails". What "permit"? Sounds like a lot of double-talk. Truly ask him about the Orange County Tax assessments - and why his organization is not listed as the owner of the property - the organization who pays annual taxes. Ask him about his liability insurance coverage in the event that a biker is injured riding into his barbed wire fencing.... that might be worth a few chuckles.
 
Based on the land manager mentioning the parcel being "conserved for open space and species mitigation" and their permit with State and Federal Fish & Game it sounds like this is a parcel purchased to mitigate for habitat destroyed by a development elsewhere. When a developer destroys sensitive habitat and endangered species they must acquire land nearby with those same species and habitat for permanent conservation to offset what their project destroys. This is required as part of their development permit, which is ultimately signed off by state and federal wildlife agencies. That's probably what he is referring to by "our permit." In these cases US F&W or CDFW often take ownership, and they can outsource management to a company like this. Maybe at other times ownership transfers to the land management company.

What sucks is we lose any trails on the land that is developed and we lose access to whatever trails are on the mitigation property with no regard to long-standing use or connectivity. Often the wildlife agencies sign off on these properties as being pristine even though they may have existing trails or other environmental damage on them. Developer would be required to acquire even more land if they were deemed not pristine, which would have been the correct assessment. This process often does not allow for any public access on mitigation parcels. The land manager typically puts up a fence around the mitigation parcel and some signage and expects everyone to stay out. You likely aren't going to be able to reason with them to change anything.

Meanwhile the parcel is often surrounded by homes and businesses and those locals usually expect they can recreate on open spaces like the mitigation parcel. In San Diego we have a bunch of these mitigation properties and the developers advertised them as parks with trails that people could use, when selling homes in adjacent communities.

A couple things you can do - bring this to the attention of OC MTBA and ask for their help. Maybe they can work with the land owner to close down the illegal trails in exchange for allowing legal access on the main trail you're wanting to use. Also, contact local politicians. They might have some sway. Failing that, do what I mentioned earlier. Let the dust settle. Someone will keep cutting the barbed wire. The land manager does not have endless resources to police this parcel. Keep riding it once re-opened, and be prepared to turn back if you see a ranger truck.
 
BonsaiNut said:
Let me take it up a notch... here is the Google Maps image showing where his PDF map lies, as well as the barbed wire fence and the truck trail that connects Aliso Creek Trail to Whiting Ranch:
View attachment 94635
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The trails listed on "their map" are all game trails and not anything that has been ridden. I've ridden this area hundreds if not thousands of times, and there are no obvious or ridable trails in their "map". a cop out from someone living in another county not giving a crap about the well being of the local residents. And yes, the builders said there are hiking trails in the area, but now they're barbed off....I'd be pissed if I bought one of those over priced houses to find out they did this. This and where the homes are built were all marked " permanent open space" when I moved near here....permanent only until it's not.
 
I am pretty sure that the nice fences are put up by the management company, but when there is rusted barbwire across the trail along with rocks and branches blocking the entrance to the trail, I am pretty sure that is the work of a disgruntled homeowner. I so want to see who is doing this so I can have a conservation about the so-called "Nature Habitat" and all the houses that were built on said habitat. Also, they are obviously walking past the no trespassing signs to put up these obstacles, so they are "breaking the law themselves". A nice person nicely made openings where the fences were and wrapped the wire around the post. Nothing was torn out or destroyed. Then some others feel the need to completely tear down the fence and throw the poles into the bushes (I have a feeling it is kids on Surons as I see the circles on the trails where they do burnouts). I am sure that is what is bothering the management company. When it is done nicely, it is not tacky and leaves a small opening.
 
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