"E mtn bikes r us" (rock n road) boycott?

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StrandLeper

StrandLeper

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Stopped into Rock nRoad while running errands. Looking for a couple of things. See the S works e mtn bike on display. Tell the clerk: "This is wrong on every level." She says "Don't knock it till you try it." I say "I didn't say it doesn't look fun, it's just wrong. This is being marketed for single track. Access in OC is a huge issue. These will end our access." And left.

(For example, a three-some with two hot Brazilian chicks would likely be fun. As I am married and old, however, it would be wrong. [i know, it's a bit of a gray area, but trust me... It would be wrong])

Rock n Road is a (relatively) small business. They only had one e-mtn bike on display there.

I am not a "boycott" guy.

But I will not give them my money whilst they promote the e-mtn bike.

I don't get my stuff from e-bike shops.

I get my stuff from bike shops.

Thoughts?
 
The bicycle business is changing rapidly. Many of the giants are beginning to offer direct to consumer sales. Changes could be accelerated when Canyon begins selling in the US market. Rock n Road, Jax, Performance and REI that I know of offer ebikes. In general ebikes are more profitable and require more frequent parts and service. They may be a necessary "evil" for a shop to survive.
 
@slomosapien i agree that the big scary monster is the dept of interior and ignorant pandering politicians who think that the Sierra Club speaks for the entire outdoor rec community. That is a massive danger that right now in my life, I can do nothing about.

After I retire from my practice, ensuring access will be one of my avocations.

(I have been to this rodeo before. A few years ago Orange County banned a certain recreation that I enjoy. They reversed the ban within a month after a well organized campaign... I didn't even have to sue ... But in billable hours terms, it cost me a lot of money. When I tried the same approach with the Coast Guard, I met a stone wall... Even though they violated their own required rule making process and People are literally dying today because of the rule ... Didn't have time to sue... Still don't, thank goodness ... The Feds are a whole nother kettle o' fish)

BUT what is potentially hindering MY access to MY trails that I ride are unskilled newbies on Ebikes. So, from a self interest perspective, this is a "battle of immediacy". (We humans tend to act in self interest).

And when I see a bike shop that has SIGNIFICANT influence on new riders, that is one mile from my favorite trail, pushing an e mtn bike designed for trail riding, I am going to stir up some shizzle.

Especially after getting buzzed by e-bikes two weeks in a row on these every trails.

Thoughts?
 
Someone made a good analogy to me the other day.....

Ebikes are like kinda like smoking....or "vaping". Smoking was outlawed in specific areas...but people said, I'm "vaping" not smoking....it's different. Eventually the laws and rules caught up and it is seen as the same exact thing.

I just think that ebikes are ahead of the laws and the laws will catch up. Sooner rather than later....hopefully.
 
It is your right to boycott just as much as some else's right to spend their money there. The market will figure this one out. Specialized brought the Levo to European market 4 years ago. They have a factory in Switzerland making Levo only. Europe has widely accepted there use on trails. My understanding is the Forest Service approved there use on the Backbone Trail.

There is a place for all under the recreation tent. I own a Levo and it eats up sand washes in Anza Borrego. I really have no desire to ride it in the County Parks. They are extremely limited by the battery. I will go through a full charge in the 2500ft 6 miles climb up Coal Canyon to Sierra Peak.

Dean
 
Still enjoy mine whether they're ever allowed on trails or not. Additionally, enjoyed fabricating them. There are enough legal places to ride (mostly fire roads where all street legal vehicles are allowed) and bike lanes to satisfy me. Will also permit my wife and I to bikepack places like Santa Rosa where the climb with camping gear may be too hard. Main utility AFAICS is for riders of different strength to ride together (and don't say the weaker one should just get stronger --- many times it just ain't going to happen). Wouldn't want them allowed on trails if it impaired MTB access.
 
F it! Let's go climb Cholla!!! P R City!

image.jpeg


Converted the old cafe bike to an e bike.
 
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@StrandLeper not sure by your post if you let them know they were no longer getting your dollars. Did you tell them that? As well, telling the cashier clerk may not be the best way to get your position across to the store owner.
It's true, when you own a Speshy shop, you sold your soul to Specialized.
If we are indeed going to boycott E-Shops we should let them know we are...

fos'l said:
Still enjoy mine whether they're ever allowed on trails or not. Additionally, enjoyed fabricating them. There are enough legal places to ride (mostly fire roads where all street legal vehicles are allowed) and bike lanes to satisfy me. Will also permit my wife and I to bikepack places like Santa Rosa where the climb with camping gear may be too hard. Main utility AFAICS is for riders of different strength to ride together (and don't say the weaker one should just get stronger --- many times it just ain't going to happen). Wouldn't want them allowed on trails if it impaired MTB access.
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@fos'l , I truly admire your statement. I genuinely appreciate you contemplating the big picture. You just got big Kudos in my book! ha hah!:thumbsup: Bike on Brothah!
 
StrandLeper said:
Stopped into Rock nRoad while running errands. Looking for a couple of things. See the S works e mtn bike on display. Tell the clerk: "This is wrong on every level." She says "Don't knock it till you try it." I say "I didn't say it doesn't look fun, it's just wrong. This is being marketed for single track. Access in OC is a huge issue. These will end our access." And left.

(For example, a three-some with two hot Brazilian chicks would likely be fun. As I am married and old, however, it would be wrong. [i know, it's a bit of a gray area, but trust me... It would be wrong])

Rock n Road is a (relatively) small business. They only had one e-mtn bike on display there.

I am not a "boycott" guy.

But I will not give them my money whilst they promote the e-mtn bike.

I don't get my stuff from e-bike shops.

I get my stuff from bike shops.

Thoughts?
Click to expand...
Good luck buying from any LBS then. Laguna Cyclery carries them. BikeCo peddles them, and I am sure you can get one at The Path too.
 
I am working on an email to the manager.

I like the shop. I have spent a bit of dough there on pricey speshy shoes and other accessories... Been fitted, etc. I never EVER ask for a bro deal. I see the employees on the trails, a good friend rides for their team.

If they market and sell the bike responsibly, they can earn my business. It just didn't seem like that was what was going on.

Just like the SUP store that rented SUPs to clueless tourists on huge days, right at a tough and dangerous surf spot. Told them about their irresponsibility and never darkened their door again. (Never bought much from them in the first place, however). This is the same concept. IF e Mtn bikes are the difference between LBS's making it or failing, then that sucks but they have a duty to sell them responsibly.

Right next to the shiny new toy they should have a disclaimer about where you can and can't ride... Right next to the product. Otherwise, they are defrauding their customers (fraudulent concealment sort of).

It was a bit jarring to see the E S Works mtb bike sitting right next to the Stumpjumper. No disclaimer, no nothing. Visually implying "If you like our Stumpjumper, you will LOVE our E S Works Mtn Bike!"

Do we expect the new e mtn biker to magically know the rules of which trail systems he can use, and which he can't use? No way! He is just excited to be able to ride! Can't blame him!! He just (or she just) doesn't know.

Maybe they train their employees to give this education at the point of sale... I don't know.

Maybe I over reacted from two weekends of e riders riding illegally, one on a narrow techy trail. Goodness knows, I have never over reacted before!

I will share how the manager responds to my thoughtful inquiry.

Thanks for all of the 411 and the responses.
 
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@fos'l thanks! it's the 24volt 250 watt kit from clean republic. You can get it from Amazon, clicking right through from this site. I ran out of puttering time today and have to do a bit of filing on the front fork and dialing in the mounting. Keeping the battery in the basket makes it too front- heavy. I think the battery will actually fit in the bottle cage. I removed my heavy metal fenders, so I think I only added 2 pounds or so. Gonna add my surf racks tomorrow.
 
There is no reason we couldn't start our own etiquette program and try to get the shops to buy in. We develop a "trail access and etiquette" manual, and we get shops to buy into getting customers to read one and take the pledge with every bike or frame sold. It's in their best interest to keep trails open so that they have customers. It's in all of our interests to educate every mt. biker, or at least get in their ear about appropriate trail use and manners. That would take care of e-mt. bikes as well.

Too simple?
 
@StrandLeper, did you look at the price tag on the Levo? I don't see some newbie MTBers dropping some 5-8k. When I bought my Levo from R&R they did give me a copy of AB1096 and did state use on motorized trails only. Many items are sold without disclaimers posted on the product. The magic in knowing where to ride is just like the magic we have here in Laguna knowing what trails are legal and which ones are not. Stupid is as stupid does and no amount of disclaimers will change behaviors. Every day in Laguna folk ride Telonics and a dozen other illegal trails, everyone knows that they risk a ticket but it continues. I know people that have received tickets and are still out there riding illegal trails. I am a very slow rider going uphill and often I need to pull over and let faster riders pass. It as never got my panties in a bunch....I just deal with it.

Dean
 
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dstepper said:
@StrandLeper, did you look at the price tag on the Levo? I don't see some newbie MTBers dropping some 5-8k. When I bought my Levo from R&R they did give me a copy of AB1096 and did state use on motorized trails only. Many items are sold without disclaimers posted on the product. The magic in knowing where to ride is just like the magic we have here in Laguna knowing what trails are legal and which ones are not. Stupid is as stupid does and no amount of disclaimers will change behaviors. Every day in Laguna folk ride Telonics and a dozen other illegal trails, everyone knows that they risk a ticket but it continues. I know people that have received tickets and are still out there riding illegal trails. I am a very slow rider going uphill and often I need to pull over and let faster riders pass. It as never got my panties in a bunch....I just deal with it.

Dean
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Hey @dstepper , thanks for posting this info that they do indeed (at least at R&R) provide the legalities in regards to trail access.

I also think you are right in regards to stupid is what stupid does. If @StrandLeper is getting buzzed by E-Bikes on the trail even when given documents that clearly spell out the law, then there "is" good reason to be concerned with E-Bikes.

I know this is a pointless debate. Just like Strandleper pointed out in Post #5, "We humans tend to act in self interest"
Which tells me that those in favor of E-Bikes are not really going to listen to the concerns of others for the big picture. That makes me sad....:(
 
@herzalot thoughtful and interesting idea.

@dstepper true on products sold w/o disclaimers. There is an ethic to this sport. Some of it, I am still learning (use your front brake more... Don't ruin the trail with your rear wheel sliding... I don't slide the rear wheel much... I am trying to eliminate the occasional breaking of contact). There is an ethic to climbing, surfing, and most other sports that impact our limited resources. The newb won't know the ethic. By the time a newb can even get to Rattlesnake or Lizards or Ticketron, he is probably not as much of a newb... As he had to work his butt off to get there... And bcz he is getting there on his own power and doesn't want to get lost, is probably with more experienced friends, teaching him the rules of the road.

Same w the newb e Mtn biker? Who is going to be teaching him?

That was a long way to say that I hold climbing shops, cycling shops, surf shops to a higher standard when selling products.

As to the Levo's price tag, yup it's pricey. The same price as the SWorks Epic. In the land of the 30k weekend Harleys, it doesn't seem like a stretch to think that newbs will by this bike.

It's fantastic that RnR gave you a copy of the bill. What did they say about LWP and Aliso? Was there any "winking" going on?

I didnt get my panties in a bunch bcz electron man dropped me. (I only wear panties when engaging in threesomes with hot Brazilians... And my wife frowns upon that... And I am old ... So me in panties is pretty rare).

I was just bummed that an e biker was buzzing very fast up a trial that people descend very fast. I was bummed that my e encounter the week before at Aliso wasn't just an isolated incident. I was bummed that when I am yelling "rider, rider" going through the hollows on Lizards at speed, I may run into an electron man who has not gained the skill to go as fast as he is going ... And that he may hurt or kill me, a friend, a hiker, or a fellow biker with his heavy machine. I was bummed that the place where our sport / passion was, is gone... Forever. I was bummed at "progress."

Time to ride.
 
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At least one ebike shop stated that Class 1 bikes were legal in city, county and state parks citing 1096. Didn't matter to me since I didn't purchase an ebike there (all my ebikes are DIY ). However if someone purchases an eMTB and thinks it's legal on trails, it's likely they'll start riding them. Agree that something needs to be done to prevent this from occurring. Also think that this group should attempt to educate the manufacturers on the potential hornet's nest they are creating.
 
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