Maxxis Ardent

Varaxis

Varaxis

Well-Known Member
I just put a Maxxis Ardent 26x2.4 tire on my front wheel with fresh stan's recently to try something new, since my stan's dried out in my last tire (Spec Purgatory 2.3 Control). On my first test ride, I "washed out" twice on both sidewalk concrete and pavement trying to figure out this "vague at certain lean angles" thing I keep hearing about. Scary and embarrassing... I don't normally lean past the slip angle, so I'll be wearing armor while riding this tire, I'm thinking.

Makes me wonder how many people have been injured due to this tire. I know there's people who have gotten accustomed to it, able to enjoy it, but are there those that have wrote it off due to bad experiences? I'm curious...
 
The Ardent is one of my favorite tires. Good cornering traction and a decent roller. I have one on the front of my Tallboy right now. I used to have one on the rear too, but I wore it out and had an Ikon sitting on the shelf.

I used to only look for tires with transition knobs. But I read a lot of good reviews on the Ardent and decided to try it out. I learned to really accentuate my lean in corners to get the most out of the Ardent. I read somewhere to focus on pushing down with your inside hand. I'm still practicing with that method. Wider bars seemed to help too. I just put 750mm wide ones on my Tallboy.

I went to a Highroller II on my Pivot Mach 6. Even better grip than the Ardent, but it comes with a pretty big weight penalty.
 
The slip happens at a pretty sharp angle on flat turns, even worse on high speed off-cambers. It's okay on bermed corners. I thought I'd get used to it like I did with High Rollers, but it's kind of scary.

This tire doesn't like leaning much. It seems to prefer handlebar steering. If I set my mind to ride through the slip, it's still abrupt enough to throw me off balance, especially when it hooks up again and kind of stands me up. It's about a 45 degree lean angle; I never leaned that far on my 29er, until after I started riding a 26". Today, I tried to adapt to handlebar steering and I'm surprised by how sharper my bike takes turns. It actually wants to cut the ruts and noob lines like Sam Hill... but then it failed at 20+ MPH trying to make a right hander in the middle of a G-out dip, and simply wanted to go straight, right into the rocks of the side of the trail. It wasn't so hot on the high speed wide sweepers on fireroads. I guess that makes sense since on a downward sloping surface, if your tire is turned on it wanting to make a left/right, it turns into an off-camber in relation to the tire's stance.

Regarding technique, I don't push on my handlebars, nor try and weight my tires. I try for a natural, light-touched, balanced style with aggressive stance (chin directly above the stem), that tries to let the bike do what it wants and work with it, rather than fight it. I get what you're saying, pushing the inside grip down to corner, but that's basically advice to get me to cause the slip and that alone doesn't set you up for a forgiving stance that can allow for slips and unexpected movement.
 
Another thing I learned after trying many, many front tires: once you lose confidence in a tire, it's probably time to try something else.

What pressure are you running? How much do you weigh? Tubeless?

For comparison, I run 26 psi, run tubeless, and weigh 185 lbs. I ride trails all over Temecula and the surrounding area.
 
20 front 26x2.4, 25 rear, 145 lbs, tubeless, Perris/Riverside. Rode Oaks on Thursday and the opposite happened to me on that trail, with my rear end turning completely sideways going down Coachwhip, in one of the mid-trail twisties (chicane thingees), causing me to do a MLB slide. The front worked okay, but that trail system has mostly tight bermed switchbacks, and I was going kind of slow due to not being familiar with those trails and getting drained on the climbs.

It's not that I don't have confidence in it. The tire really is radically different from than my other tires. It's kind of niche and novel, in a way. The High Roller was also niche and novel, and had its weaknesses too (slow, wears out fast, flimsy), but that was my favorite tire for general fun and thrills. These characteristics make it interesting. It's got a bite that makes it feel like you mounted up a rear tire backwards, but it's so sensitive to direction change up front that it'd wander if you are sloppy with your inputs.

I was actually feeling like I was trying to keep the tire perpendicular to the ground on my latest ride. I'm sure I can make those fast downhill turns if I enter wider on my next ride. The tire's nuances are not making me want to tear it off. I'm basically curious about how polarizing this tire can be, as it strikes me as a tire that wouldn't match everyone, but might match some people very well and make others hate it. I never experienced this issue with the 29x2.2 Ardents I had on my 29er, but my riding style has changed quite a bit since then.
 
I have run the Ardent 2.25, 2.4 Exo, and 2.25 Race Exo on both my Tallboy and my Highball Al.

They are great tires...not so much a fan of the non-Exo tires. I find I have to run too much PSI in them.

I am 180-185 lbs.

The 2.4 I run at about 24 psi tubeless...corners great.

The 2.25 Ardent Race I run at about 20-22 psi tubeless...again, corners great. However you have to be very aggressive with it.

I have not used the 26" versions.
 
I was thinking about getting the Ardent, is there a learning curve to this tire. I have the Crossmarks right now and want to put an Ardent in front.
 
Yes, it does have a learning curve, especially if you're unfamiliar with tires similar to it. Don't slap it on the front before trying Snow Summit. Since you're coming off of something with less traction, but with similar compound (Maxxis rubber compounds are IMO the best for dry dusty rocky terrain like ours in SoCal), I bet that you would have it 80% figured out in 2 rides, and 95% in 5, as long as you have a decently quick learning speed. So far I'm liking it. It even plows sand in a rad way. I want to try one in the back too, since I'm actually pushing the limits on the front so hard in corners that my rear is sliding quite often.

Its weakness is pretty unforgiving. I took a turn a fast fireroad sweeper so wide today that I ended up like 15 feet off the trail, because I barely missed a rain rut on the inside to get support. I'm not exaggerating--I never failed that badly on my other tires, perhaps running 5 feet off of the trail. On the other hand, its performance otherwise is much better than I expected, to the point I'm creating many new tighter lines around corners (and wider entries on off-camber ones) on a trail I've ridden dozen of times, to take advantage of the tire.
 
Thanks for the information on the tire. I am a quick learner, and will order the 2.25 instead of the 2.4 everyone seems to be going to. I have used various tires also and Maxxis seems to be one of the best tires out there. My favorite is the ADvantage but they don't make that in a 27.5 yet, hopefully they will.
 
Think I got a bit too over zealous cutting turns with this tire up front. Tried to use the rut on the inside for support, lost traction in the rear (admittedly a cheap tire that's getting rather bald), handlebar dug into the dirt, and the rest of the bike (and me) swung around almost 180:

[youtube]hwlTzPBmuNI[/youtube]
 
I notice that it has noticeably better traction and comfort with even lower pressure, but its rolling resistance gets worse. I did a test on my local loop after pumping up my tire to 20, dropping pressure to around 15 and doing another lap. It turned out that while I felt like my body had warmed up and loosened up, and was more eager to sprint, my times on all the little segments on my trail went up a little. Since I'm not really a racer, I think I'll take the lower pressure and accept the extra rolling resistance--it at least feels fast to me, and that's what makes the ride fun, and not the actual times.

Edit: Strava segment times
 
Well I decided on a whim to try the Vee Rubber Trail Taker 2.4. The tire is huge compared to the Crossmark on the back. I put it on the front and set it up tubeless. I rode it around in a dirt lot near my house and it felt pretty good. I will test it out this weekend and will let you know how rolls. I was thinking about putting one in the back also but it would be overkill for my hardtail.
 
After trying the tire in a few more environments, such as SART and Sycamore, I think I'm putting the old Purgatory back on up front. The Ardent's upright and handlebar steering conflicts with the style I naturally want to go with. I ride more typical wide, fast, and open SoCal trails which requires a different skillset than tight singletrack. When I got on my HT to ride my local 7 mile loop, I noticed the style I picked up to maximize the Ardent's performance had crossed over to my skills on my HT for the worse.

Handlebar turning seems to make more sense on a trail like SART where there's hard obstacles that you might collide with if you lean, on the inside of the turn. Trying a sharp handlebar turn on a typical tire might have resulted in a wash out, while the Ardent seems to be able to whip around with the directional traction it offers.

[youtube]FHi-L-WKAW4[/youtube]
 
Was also disappointed by Ardent performance too. Went back to old Bontrager 29-3 2.25 Team Issue 120tpi, with the long tread blocks. This tire still rails turns, all without the radical lean angles of smaller tread ones. Why Bontrager stopped making this model - is simply beyond me. Replaced both Ardents with Bontys and made the bike much more stable, supple and roll like Rocket Rons.

29_3_teamissue.jpg
 
I always felt the Ardent rolled well, decent volume, and grip at most angles. But, that vague point never gave me confidence. I am now rolling a Kenda BBG (with a tube). I absolutely love this tire for Sycamore, SART, and Aliso. It is mounted up on a Blunt 35, so, its a bit flatter profile. That might be why it seems to hook up instantly into the lean. I only wish they made it in 29er.

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